What the FUD?! – Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt in the lifestyle

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Mickey & Mallory dig into three of the most destructive emotions in the lifestyle; Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt!
They discuss how those emotions play into common lifestyle interactions, what some of the most common fears are affecting LS couples, and how to overcome some of them.

Then, former adult film star Jeff James joins us for a new segment we call “WWJD,” or “What Would Jeff Do?”  We discuss one of the most paralyzing fears in the lifestyle, performance anxiety.  How to beat it (no pun intended) and look like a pro!

Hedonism II Resort, Negril Jamaica
Jeff & Aubrie’s Art Instagram
Rachals Rascals
Pineapple Parties Jacksonville

Hearing impaired? This podcast is transcribed for your convenience.

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SE01E12 – Casual Swinger – What the FUD

Thu, 9/2 9:56AM • 1:06:11


fear, people, talk, condoms, swinger, lifestyle, uncertainty, listeners, put, couple, fucking, happen, jeff, bag, pretty, call, casual, doubt, party, good


Mickey Gordon, Jeff James, Mallory Gordon


Mallory Gordon  00:09

Welcome to casual swear, if you’re under 18, the following podcast is not appropriate for you. The subjects and language are for mature audiences only. If you’re not mature in nature, just make sure you’re old enough to vote. We don’t take ourselves seriously ever. no guarantee is given regarding the accuracy of pinions, or statements made on this podcast or website or a blog. It’s all in fun, folks. This isn’t Dr. Koh. Now consider yourself listener properly advised everybody and welcome back to another episode of casual swinger. My name is Mickey. And I’m Mallory. And we’re talking bud. What the Fudd? Right. fear, uncertainty and doubt. Yeah, that’s a pretty strong acronym and some scary words in there.


Mickey Gordon  01:05

It’s a nasty cocktail for the lifestyle. Yes, it is. So we’re going to talk about that a little bit. And we’re going to catch up with our friend Jeff James, what would Jeff do? Yes. What would Jeff do, that’s gonna be our final segment of the day. But before we get into all that, maybe we tell people what we’ve been up to, and what’s going on and where we’re going. Yeah, lots


Mallory Gordon  01:25

of irons in the fire lately. So this has been really exciting. Just I know, we’ve talked a lot about the dates and the parties, we you know, we’re have been to, we’re going to, I just want to stress the importance of putting yourself out there. I think fear is a paralyzer in so many ways, and we prevent ourselves from doing those things. And it’s just been so positive in our lifestyle, that I just want to encourage anyone out there, you know, to just go for it, put yourself out there. Don’t be too scared to do so because there’s you could reap some really amazing benefit.


Mickey Gordon  01:56

Right. And so I think a really good example of that is, you know, we’ve made some pretty cool friends here so far. And I think that’s awesome. But you know, you’re scrolling through STC or SLS or Cassidy, and you see that profile of that couple and you’re like, wow, they seem really cool. Or they seem really interesting. Or maybe they’re really attractive. And for whatever reason, you don’t send the message. Maybe it’s you’re shy, maybe you think maybe maybe you think they’re out of your league, right. I think you should always send the message. always send the message in. We can say from personal experience, right? We’ve we’ve sent the message. Yeah. And it’s worked out really well worked


Mallory Gordon  02:38

out very, very well. So I’m pleased. So just to let you listeners know, we have our pom poms out for you. Yeah, we do the band aid off to it.


Mickey Gordon  02:45

So put yourself out there. But we’re going to talk more about flight here in a little bit. Let’s talk about last night.


Mallory Gordon  02:51

Last night was wonderful. That was very impromptu, and pretty amazing. Mickey and I had a last minute date, we disconnected from our technologies, went out had a very nice meal or present and came home had a music listening party and I have to say that’s one of my favorite things to do.


Mickey Gordon  03:11

Yeah, that was unplanned. It happened. So the funny part is we go out and you know we went to Ruth’s Chris we had a really nice dinner and it was we ate the bar because you know, we’re white trash, but we decided we were gonna go and and have a good meal. And we got back and we tried we raced because we have older kids, and they were out for the evening. Oh, yeah, we’ve got the whole store so what’s gonna happen brown chicken brown cow, right. So we come racing home we can roaring through the neighborhood like a bat out of hell. We will pull up in the driveway and what do we see our fucking kids back in the driveway.


Mallory Gordon  03:50

Don’t get me wrong. I love them. And it’s always a joy to have some time to spend with them. But that was not


Mickey Gordon  03:55

the plan. Oh, no. I was I was I had a dick so hard a cat couldn’t scratch. And I’m sitting there going What am I supposed to do with this? Do you know what we’ll kill a dick that’s so hard to Calkins graduate your children standing in the driveway they’ll kill it in a heartbeat because they


Mallory Gordon  04:11

were so excited to see. So we did spend time with the kids for a little bit and then we’re like deuces.


Mickey Gordon  04:19

Yeah, gotta go we did hang with them for a little bit. And I’m pretty sure like a dog fart or something and we all dispersed but it was it was everybody’s gagging run. But you know, that was a lot of fun. And we got up into our media room and played some vinyl and


Mallory Gordon  04:36

got naked and nega did a photo shoot. Yeah, you


Mickey Gordon  04:40

guys are gonna be the fortunate recipients of all these pictures that we took. And, you know, I spent some time making those photos fit our brand, right because there’s kind of a specific way if you guys follow us on Twitter, Instagram or anywhere else, you can see that our photos all have kind of the same look and feel. So sometimes I sit back and I really love that. I can Sure you the way I see you. Oh, my heart one of my favorite things to do with those.


Mallory Gordon  05:07

Yeah, cuz sometimes I look at him I’m like, Oh my God, that’s me. No way. And I almost feel like is this false advertising? And you’re like no, not even.


Mickey Gordon  05:17

Not even little anybody. Of course there’s a few of you out there that have actually met us in real life. And the review is always the same. Why is she with you?


Mallory Gordon  05:25

Oh, that’s not true.


Mickey Gordon  05:28

But you know, we had a great time. And I think you talked a little trash talk a lot


Mallory Gordon  05:33

of trash, it was dirty talk all the way we get to use that neat chair.


Mickey Gordon  05:39

Oh my god, that chair that we’ve never fucking Yeah, we’ve had that thing for like a year and a half. And we don’t know what it’s called. We wish we did. We think it’s expensive because it’s really well built. It was a gift from some friends of ours. Yes. And it’s shaped in kind of like a wave


Mallory Gordon  05:52

it is. And what I love about it is whether it’s for oral positioning for you are, or for sexual positioning. It’s actually really comfortable. Well, and in ergonomical, like, I didn’t ask, I just struggled in your face. I know I loved every second of it, too. Yeah, I wasn’t around and grab your ass and start pulling you in.


Mickey Gordon  06:15

But you know, the fifth My favorite part about that year, so your favorite is that it’s comfy and ergonomic. My favorite is that we convinced our children It was a video game chair and


Mallory Gordon  06:25

only slightly awkward when you walk in. And they are literally sitting there playing video games. And we’ve never used this chair before yesterday, before yesterday.


Mickey Gordon  06:32

Now if they sit in really get out, get out what’s the sticky spot, right? But you know, the thing is, it’s bright, fucking red. And it doesn’t go with the room at all in any way, shape, or form. If I knew what the name of it was, I would check and see if they made a cover for it. Quite so obnoxiously like, ooh, like, it’s just


Mallory Gordon  06:53

it literally raises his hand and says I’m here. Everybody looked at me


Mickey Gordon  06:56

want to fuck I’m getting the chair. But that thing was awesome. We put you in that chair like 14 different ways we played with lighting last night. With the screen as a backdrop last night, that was really cool. We did some really cool stuff. And there, we listen to some good vinyl. And you know, why are we telling you this? Because it’s important for you to take the time? Absolutely. Right. It’s because we’re going to talk about fear today. And we’re going to talk about how fear can play a part in the decisions we make. And more importantly, the decisions we don’t make, right? And that fear can, it really can perpetuate itself deeper into your relationship it can when you don’t spend the time together. And then and you haven’t connected and you haven’t spent time talking to each other and being sexy together and being in each other. And then all of a sudden you go out with a couple and you have all these erupted in securities that you never anticipated. And there’s underlying issues.


Mallory Gordon  07:48

They’re not okay, how are we going to do that? Exactly, exactly. And I will draw some personal lines for the listeners on once we get into that, because I think that’s something I battle with pretty often. And it’s definitely tied to some of my own insecurities. So


Mickey Gordon  08:01

yeah, you know, we were listening to J and K in the truck. This was right. Yeah, they were talking and they actually had a listener question. Jane Quaid, Jane Kay, or that couple next door, just so you know who those guys are. But they were they did a listener question on, you know, how do you guys deal with juggling time, and they talked about staying connected, I kind of laugh to myself, because it’s such a big deal for us. And you know, if you’ve got small kids, you got to have your kid time and your family time and your us time. You know, when do I have time for this. And if you’re like me, you’re an outdoorsman. And you want to get out and you want to fish and you want to go out you want to work on your stuff. And there’s just not a lot of time and you have to make it


Mallory Gordon  08:39

you actually have to make it you have to divide the pie. You’re not going to get a bigger pie. The size is always the same. Only 24 hours a day, seven days a week. You’re really not. And you know, speaking of time this weekend, all weekend long. One of the things I’ve been working on in my spare time, which by the way, the leak that sprung in our laundry room today.


Mickey Gordon  08:59

started raining. It started raining in our laundry room today like bitch What the fuck? Anyway, so that happened, but I was in here trying to design swag for you guys. Cuz so excited. We’re turning in.


Mallory Gordon  09:13

Yeah, yeah. So this is where I’m ordering a bunch of different swag for Navin and Nolan’s which we’re going into July, right. Yeah. The 23rd I believe. So we have some cool shit. Shit we haven’t typically seen before. Some of you have. But you know, with our personal spin on it.


Mickey Gordon  09:30

We’ve designed all new stuff. I mean, we’ve got all new I mean, everything is. So this is I don’t want to


Mallory Gordon  09:35

give away any spoilers.


Mickey Gordon  09:36

I can tell anybody what we’re bringing, but somebody better be ready to show me there.


Mallory Gordon  09:40

Yeah, I want to see lots of great stuff for for you guys. So if you’re going and you see us there, definitely come find us track us down. We have a bunch of shit to give you.


Mickey Gordon  09:51

Yeah, that’s right. And so I think what we’re going to do before we go is we’ll probably do some kind of a thing on the show where you We’ll give you a code word you have to come up into in say the car.


Mallory Gordon  09:59

I love that game like password.


Mickey Gordon  10:01

Yeah. And if they come up and they say the code word, then we’ll give them the extra special swag. Not the like, cheap shit that we give everybody else.


Mallory Gordon  10:08

It’s not cheap shit.


Mickey Gordon  10:12

Credit Card. Boy, by the way, if you’re thinking about starting a podcast and you’re thinking about starting a podcast to make money, don’t


Mallory Gordon  10:17

Yeah, no. Bad idea, but it is a lot of fun. So what else we got going


Mickey Gordon  10:23

on? Well, we’re going places. Yeah. So when you get back from Chicago, which, by the way, hope you don’t freeze his tits off, because speaking of


Mallory Gordon  10:30

nipples might actually just freeze and fall off but we’ll see. I’m like negative 30


Mickey Gordon  10:34

It’s gonna be so fucking cold up there. And I mean, it’s not gonna be warm here in Florida. It’s not warm. Now. It rained all day late. It’s 40 degrees and you’re going to Chicago and what’s the temperature up there?


Mallory Gordon  10:43

literally like negative there. No temperature exists. There isn’t one. There is no one with the windshields gonna be like negative 20 negative 30. So


Mickey Gordon  10:50

yeah, so anyway, that’s that’s hoping to track down Mallory in Chicago to hang out. Don’t think about it. She won’t be outside.


Mallory Gordon  10:57

No, I won’t be outside. I know I’ll still look like Randy’s you know little brother from Christmas Story inside put my arms No, no, no, I’m just gonna bring catheter with me so I don’t have to undress the other bathroom. expose any of the goodies. Yeah, free class.


Mickey Gordon  11:10

It’s easy. So you’re going to Chicago when you get back from Chicago? We’ve got a pineapple party. That’s


Mallory Gordon  11:15

right. We’re heading up to Jacksonville to see some friends of ours and do a meet and greet right in K and a


Mickey Gordon  11:20

all day. Yeah, right. Hello. What uh, so we had a really cool date with them a couple weeks Yeah,


Mallory Gordon  11:26

we did we we transfer around St. Augustine went to a cool restaurant a cool bar. I think we talked about this a little bit on the last we


Mickey Gordon  11:36

did that was a lot of fun. But we’re gonna go see these guys here. We got a party coming up with those guys. And of course we are prepping right now. So February 1 is right around the corner.


Mallory Gordon  11:44

Yeah, we are 30 days out from our February rascals trip to go going back to heat. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you can you hear the sadness in my voice. I’m so excited. So if anyone’s interested in traveling with us, you have time in February you want to book a lot last minute trip. Please hit us up on our website at casual swinger calm. There’s a forum there that you can enter your information and our travel agent will send you the booking info. We do not get paid for this. We just go we host we have a good time. And your information will not be sold to any you know, respective third parties or any that other bullshit.


Mickey Gordon  12:21

No, but I will probably send all of you dick pics, just because I mean, it’s what I do. I’m getting a mechanicing dick pic, so at least not my dick. Oh, it’s in other people’s dick pics.


Mallory Gordon  12:30

That should be with me now. I’m gonna I’m gonna put a hard stop to that. I think that’s just fucking weird.


Mickey Gordon  12:35

I don’t think anybody will ever join our mailing list. If I’m like, every time I get a dick pic. Um, well, actually, no, we’ll do I’ll take all the dick pics incentive to gym or traveling or going down the hole.


Mallory Gordon  12:44

So moving on, we’re not sending dick pics.


Mickey Gordon  12:48

So the trip prep. So we’ve got all kinds of stuff going right. So what we do for the rascals is we host the parties for those guys. I go down there. I wear my top hats. Mallory, she gets out her pom poms, and we make sure that everybody has a really good time. It’s gonna be a small trip for us only like what 2530 couples?


Mallory Gordon  13:05

Yeah, it’s about it’s about 30 rooms, I believe. Yeah. Yeah, it’s gonna be a sold out resort. Yeah, it’s definitely more intimate crowd. It’s a high volume time. Because I think January to March is just constantly sold out because the timing everyone wants to get about the cold buck


Mickey Gordon  13:21

in cold North America and Canadians and then we go to Jamaica every time. So by the way, we love you Canadians love our Canadian listeners. We just don’t know how you deal with the cold.


Mallory Gordon  13:29

Exactly. So some of these couples that are coming are newbies. Um, so we’ve gotten some questions. So for anyone out there who’s going for the first time, a little few tips for the road, and we’ll make this quick. definitely bring lots of sunscreen. You can never have enough because in Jamaica, it’s like $35 a bottle on your penis though, so no, you’ll look like a leatherback turtle. It’s true. And I highly recommend pretending that you’re bomb because I never fails. every trip we go there we find a newbie who has a bamboo anass I love the big red badness though. It’s that’s pretty funny. It’s hilarious but it is painful and then it itches and then it peels and then that’s


Mickey Gordon  14:09

the need to walk up and smack somebody is already red asked Have you ever noticed


Mallory Gordon  14:12

Oh no. I think that’s very unwise. And I think there’s a consent issue. Big Issue there. Yeah, not happening but um, make sure you bring a go bag. Let’s talk about gobo I love go bag. So go bag is my go to bag for my sex toy and sexual activity means this is typically something that’s easily carried around. So it’s not a huge backpack. But it’s not like a tiny little clutch. It’s somewhere in the middle and I prefer to bring my waterproof bag because in Jamaica, you get a lot of like down you know pours in the afternoon. And I don’t always keep toys in there that are like waterproof. They may be water resistant and waterproof and maybe I have you know something else in there like a cover up or something I don’t want to get wet. So I highly recommend those and you can find them pretty cheaply on Amazon. Oh yeah, like the waterproof beach bag kind of thing. Yes, yes. And I actually bought the zipper one that has the lock with a like a folding Velcro sign just for my glue bag to put inside the other one. So like it’s a double protection.


Mickey Gordon  15:13

Double protection. By the way if I put on double protection, I can’t feel a thing. Yeah, but no. So let’s talk about go back for a second because I actually think it would be really cool for us to give away a casual swinger go bag.


Mallory Gordon  15:25

I think it would be to a wall to like, outlines the parameters for our listeners to qualify for a bank promotion to win a go bag. So what goes into go bag typically I have a couple of toys usually one something that’s insertable something that vibrates, condoms, lube, cleaner, soft cloth, soft cuffs or some sort of like maybe rope and then I’ve had floggers in there before. Um, what else do we usually put in? Go back cock rings, definitely conquering


Mickey Gordon  16:01

conquering action. And there’s pretty cool. How about about a towel for cleanup?


Mallory Gordon  16:05

Yes, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Those are handy. Yeah, I really do love the cleaners that are the multipurpose wipes that you can get in like the packets that come like 14 to 20 and a box. Those are super handy to have versus like a spray bottle that you carry around.


Mickey Gordon  16:21

Oh, very much so expect well and definitely if you’re going to be in an environment where maybe toys are going to be shared so that’s really a big deal.


Mallory Gordon  16:28

There’s something about condoms for toys.


Mickey Gordon  16:30

Yeah, condoms for toys is a big deal. If you plan on sharing toys condoms are a great thing. But the other thing about condoms is it’s important to have multiple sizes. It is and you know what you’re gonna run into


Mallory Gordon  16:40

well multiple textures because not everyone can use latex


Mickey Gordon  16:44

that’s true so it’s but so go bag can get really big really fast. So we’re gonna have to decide what goes in that casual swinger go bag but so go bag and then of course, beach go bag.


Mallory Gordon  16:58



Mickey Gordon  16:59

But what else did he What else did they bring to Hito with him?


Mallory Gordon  17:02

Um, definitely bring Lysol even though we know we don’t get sick from the AC like we all want to believe. It’s still a good idea. You know, you’re traveling in an aircraft, which is a drum cesspool. Yeah. A third world country so it really doesn’t hurt. You know, I


Mickey Gordon  17:19

can see this I’ve been to a bunch of times, and I always spray down my EC with Lysol. The last time we went, we didn’t do it. And I was sick as a damn dog.


Mallory Gordon  17:28

Okay, so we can get it do it for good measure,


Mickey Gordon  17:30

my superstition has been offended. And I hurt me. I’m still pained by it.


Mallory Gordon  17:36

So with our group, we send out cups and we do like a cup decorating contest. But it’s always good to bring an extra cup, whether that stainless steel or like plastic bubble cups or whatever it is insulated mugs, yes. Because then you have a larger cup to bring around with you that stays cold longer. And, and a secondary one, right. But also reusable straws, they’ve done away with the plastic straws, which they think is great, better for the environment. So don’t bring up a reusable straw with you. Right, ignore your comment.


Mickey Gordon  18:12

You know, something about those cups. So the other good reason you should bring your cup with you is the cups that they give you the resort. First of all, they’re not insulated. But second of all, they’re tiny. They’re like shot glasses, there’s these tiny little glasses in me, I want to carry around 200 ounces of my favorite beverage, so I don’t have to go back to the bar. So it’s like I go in and get my five gallon bucket of you know,


Mallory Gordon  18:33

don’t panic, when you have that moment of sanity where you’re like, I should drink some water at some point, then it kind of forces you to drink the whole competence because it’s larger you you’re able to actually rehydrate yourself.


Mickey Gordon  18:45

Now we should probably be clear, Mallory has the moment of sanity and says Mickey should drink some water where he’s going to be drinking a mess on the side of the pool. And waving is taking people. But okay, that may have happened. So yeah, we’re going to Hito we’re gonna have a good time. We’ll talk about it a little bit more. We’ve got an episode coming up, that we actually recorded the interviews for last November.


Mallory Gordon  19:06

Yeah. So yeah, we’ve been recording some follow ups intermittently. And I’m really excited about this, because I know we talked about it so much on this podcast. But he nism has such an interesting history and it’s touched so many people change their lives very much in so many ways. So I believe we’ll be releasing the history, the living history of hedonism sometime around or while we’re in Jamaica in February. Yeah, that’s the plan. So we’ve got some great interviews. We’re not going to tell you with who but we got some great interviews with some really influential people and he knows history. And we found a guy who went to Hito back when it was new grille, beach village 38 years ago.


Mickey Gordon  19:45

So we we got a great interview with him, he got two interviews with him. So we got to find a way to get to kind of consolidate that down but it’s gonna be a lot of fun. And we’re gonna release that, either right before or while we’re there. But without further ado, let’s get to it. Find in what the FIDE we’re going to do that after a short quick break, so Mallory, why don’t you tell everybody how they can find us and we’ll be right back.


Mallory Gordon  20:07

Alright guys, we’re casual swing or you can find us as casual swing or anywhere that is Twitter, Facebook, Instagram STC, SLS and Cassidy calm. Please look for us on our website at casual swinger calm and feel free to send us your feedback questions in commentary at podcast at as well as swinger.com. Thanks, guys, and we’ll be right back. Welcome back to casual swinger Mallory here. Oh and Mickey over here. We’re gonna talk about Fudd. Today, and what is Fudd? But is fear, uncertainty and doubt? I thought it was the Nemesis of Bugs Bunny. wesco we webbot


Mickey Gordon  21:10

I can’t even say anything. Oh, my God. So yeah. Fudd fear, uncertainty and doubt. So what is I mean, when we talk? I mean, why are we lumping these three things together? For starters?


Mallory Gordon  21:21

That’s a great question. I think it plays a role in who we are as human beings.


Mickey Gordon  21:25

But there is a role it does play absolutely in the lifestyle. Because when, especially when you’re encroaching on new territory, all of these feelings and emotions are normal and obstacles or hurdles that you overcome. Oh, yeah. And they affect our decision making process. They stop us from doing things that we’re considering. Or they also maybe inspire us to do something different because we were afraid of taking the other path. Right. Our fear is self preservation. It’s something that I think we’ll talk about a little bit more here in a second. But you know, fear for us, sometimes it’s natural, maybe something went wrong. Maybe something didn’t go the way we thought it would go. Uncertainty is I have no idea how this is going to go right? I


Mallory Gordon  22:08

have no history behind that. Right. So


Mickey Gordon  22:10

I’m no doubt in you what happens when you’re uncertain. You make up all the bad things that could happen. Amen. You watch too much fucking criminal mind,


Mallory Gordon  22:20

this is also true. But I am literally the queen of uncertainty. I have to I have to be very aware of my emotions. And when I get to that point, and I’m starting to go down that trail where I’m guessing every possible outcome of a certain situation, I have to pause, I have to take a step back and go. Am I just being uncertain? Because I have no prior data points? Yeah. Can I ask can I allow myself to let go and let it takes its course and stay on course and not stray? From the decision I made based on what I’m feeling in these crazy ideas? I’m starting to happen. Sure. And the


Mickey Gordon  22:57

ability to judge things after they’ve happened and not before they’ve had exactly don’t police behavior on yourself or other people that maybe hasn’t occurred yet. And that brings us to doubt. Yeah, and doubt is something that every person encounters, I don’t care how confident you are moments of doubt. Because maybe you have that uncertainty in that fear. And you start to doubt the outcome, you doubt the your capability to affect that outcome in a positive way, or to make things happen the way that you feel like they should?


Mallory Gordon  23:25

Absolutely or maybe you doubt that you’ll be able to cope with whatever the outcome is based on that level of uncertainty or feeling. Sure. And by


Mickey Gordon  23:32

the way, all of these things don’t just lead to issues in the lifestyle. They lead issues in our marriages, and our work environments. fear, uncertainty, and doubt. I mean, in a competitive landscape in the world that we live in our competitors place fear, uncertainty and doubt our feet all the time. Absolutely.


Mallory Gordon  23:48

It’s one of the it’s one of the most effective sales tactics there are. universally


Mickey Gordon  23:54

Yeah. And it’s bullshit. It’s total bullshit, but is usually a lie. And people sling it like they sling it all over the place. And so why do we experience the emotions that lead to fear uncertainty and doubt?


Mallory Gordon  24:06

Well, you said it best it’s it’s built in we are supposed to experiences emotions because of self preservation. Right that to sustain the species we have an eat ability to tap in to fear to prevent us from doing things that could get us killed could get us hurt.


Mickey Gordon  24:26

Yeah, but do you know who doesn’t have fear children they tidbits where they test their boundaries and until you burn the living shit out yourself you don’t know if you’re fired


Mallory Gordon  24:35

well also sociopath so well there’s also here’s that person listening going I’ve never had feel or uncertainty or doubt or whatsoever I’m fucking immortal. Yeah, go book. The the psychotherapist Right, right. Get your ass there somehow, right. But it is natural and it’s okay to experience these emotions. How we cope with them?


Mickey Gordon  24:54

Yeah, how do we cope with I mean, we can kind of break these up a little bit too because there’s a lot of things we can be afraid of. rate, I mean, our own mortality rate when you’re young. So think about being dead.


Mallory Gordon  25:04

No, no, you actually have to be taught that this thing will will kill you. Right? Please don’t run into traffic. But I mean, think about


Mickey Gordon  25:10

so as you get to be a little bit older as you reach those middle aged years, or maybe even the later years, I tell jokes about being 40 all the time I save it. The thing about being 40 is that once you turn 40, nobody goes, Oh, he was so young. at your funeral. They’re like, Oh, he lived a great life. He really think like, that’s the threshold. I think it is. It is it 40 this is like like it he’s old. He had a good life. He did. But But I think mortality is something that once you reach kind of that midlife threshold, we had Krissy until we on a couple weeks ago, and she said like 10 times about everybody’s dying, and we need new people to go to the resort. So you think that somebody and you know, she’s a couple years older than I am. But she’s not old, that she’s still thinking about mortality?


Mallory Gordon  25:54

Yeah, absolutely. I think another one, especially, you know, maybe not exclusive to women. But in my conversations, definitely more affluent among women. Is worthiness self worth? Yeah.


Mickey Gordon  26:11

Yeah. Well, and to what is that worth derived from? Because different people get their worth from different things, whether it’s being a great mom, or being a great employee, and different things fill their cup, right? And people get it from sex. I mean, some people do they attention of the opposite sex. And this is a man and woman thing, this is not a woman think, because I’ve known plenty of guys. I mean, it definitely happens. And, but so that’s fear is derived from a lot of different places. And we want to talk about why fear is a problem for us in the lifestyle, both us personally and for maybe some of our listeners out there, because fear is a quicksand, it slows us down, it stops us from making decisions that maybe could be really advantageous and put us in a position that we want to be in. Right, but it’s natural. And we want to, you know, kind of talk about it a little bit. So what do you think some of the common fears are in the lifestyle that we’ve run into with people we’ve met in ones and also,


Mallory Gordon  27:11

once we have, I think there’s, there’s many that we call universal, that we’ve all kind of experienced, especially if we’ve been in the lifestyle for a while. being outed is definitely one of them. Oh, yeah. I


Mickey Gordon  27:23

mean, you know, think about every profile we read, where they’re like, discretion is my number one thing, right? When can


Mallory Gordon  27:27

when we’ve had experiences where, you know, we’ve given our personal information, we get called out on Facebook, or they send us a work email, like it’s it got really awkward. It is a fear.


Mickey Gordon  27:39

You know, it’s funny, because we talk about, you know, people wanting people to embrace non monogamy and making it normal. I mean, there’s a whole podcast about normalizing non monogamy that’s fam and you know, it’s like, and here we are talking about how we got to keep this to ourselves. Yeah.


Mallory Gordon  27:55

Well, and it’s about our ability, you know, right. We, we need to be able to hold our jobs and our and our nine to five life and right now, it’s just not a time for us to put that into jeopardy.


Mickey Gordon  28:07

Yeah. Well, it’s funny, I think that one of the one of the bullshit things about being a guy is I would probably get away with it if I got outed every but I probably probably build a statue. Honor in the front of the building.


Mallory Gordon  28:20

Exactly. To this day is still one of my biggest frustrations is the double standard there. were like, you would be celebrated and congratulated, like whether it’s you had a one night stand with a hot girl or you’re in the lifestyle or whatever. And I would be shamed.


Mickey Gordon  28:35

Right. But you know, it’s funny ridiculed. On the level. I’ll tell you this, being the guy that you maybe you won’t understand this, this actually is something that you want a woman or no because it won’t happen. Okay, I was just gonna be careful. I’m gonna piss off all the women that listen to it. Now what I’m saying is, it’s different because guys have this like, must have my woman and no one else can look at my woman this like caveman esque attitude about themselves, where we get hypocrites when I have been outed in the past. I am ridiculed and they’re like, I can’t believe you would let your your boss sleep with another man.


Mallory Gordon  29:12

Let lead let operative word I got


Mickey Gordon  29:16

that. And that didn’t come out of my mouth. That’s something that was actually said to me. How could you let that happen? What kind of man are you? I said, Let’s go outside and I will show you right on that was my response.


Mallory Gordon  29:29

Good for you. I you know that I want to kick ass right? Yeah, you’re a fiscal motherfucker.


Mickey Gordon  29:36

Bear you But think about it. Think about how that incident that inspires fear. uncertainty and doubt. Like, I can’t get out it because what, what kind of trouble is just gonna cause me I get kicked off my softball team because I still respect me anymore.


Mallory Gordon  29:48

Yeah. And that falls into line of what other people think of us with somebody else’s perspective based on you know, X, Y, or Z. These choices I’ve made in my life or how I live my life sure, or who I am as a person, you know, kind


Mickey Gordon  29:58

of switching gears A little bit in switching to something a little more fun and not fun because it’s terrifying. In literally, we’re beyond fear. We’re beyond uncertainty revealing that we’re on straight up fucking terror. Okay, performance anxiety.


Mallory Gordon  30:10

You know? It’s not I don’t think that’s exclusive to men. But I think it is. is it’s kind of some high pressure situation. I mean, because it’s visible. Very much. So


Mickey Gordon  30:25

you know, that’s the great part about you guys. You can squirt a little bit of lube on it, and Wham you’re in business, you can fake it. Right? I mean, for me, what am I gonna do? Spit on your back? Do I know that? She hates spit?


Mallory Gordon  30:41

I can’t I can I can handle so much dirty shit. Like I I used to be in the medical field. And once upon a time in my previous life, and all of that stuff was just fine. behagelig in front of me, and I am tossing my cookies done.


Mickey Gordon  30:56

Yeah, yeah, that that typical guy behavior does not fly around Mallory now. But think about that for a minute. performance anxiety is probably the number one fear we hear about from listeners and in on Twitter and on Reddit and things like that. We hear people talking about things. And then things like swinger insurance are becoming really commonplace to affect it. But I will tell you from personal experience, swinger insurance will not save you. No more has a hold of you. Yeah, that is true. It won’t. If you if your brain is not in the game, you will lose your word even answering your insurance, you will have a stuffy nose and no heart on that is what happens. Wow. Because if your brains not in the game, and you know, here’s the thing,


Mallory Gordon  31:39

how do you kind of how do you overcome that though, as a guy?


Mickey Gordon  31:43

Well, there’s a few things right? First things first, if you want to overcome performance, anxiety, turn to your partner, turn to the person you’re comfortable with, spend some time with them, because we’ve actually had this experience where I’ll come to you, and I’ll start playing with you, when they’re in the middle of something else. And immediately things go right back to you know, bully in the game. right up front levels, everything


Mallory Gordon  32:06

conscious. So with having that that identity, you identify me with sex Very much so. And with pleasure, happy times. That makes


Mickey Gordon  32:16

that makes a lot of sense, as well. And there’s also a comfort level there there too. And you know, me and you can tell, right, if something’s not going well, for me, and you tend to jump in before I even say,


Mallory Gordon  32:27

which is pretty awesome. And I think we’re going to talk about that a little bit later on.


Mickey Gordon  32:30

We are but so performance anxiety is certainly swinger insurance, which is by Agra, Cialis, Levitra, you know, they’re all generics. Now there’s generics, if you don’t know about it, there’s a website out there called Roman. I’ll put it in the show notes if you want to check out Roman but they do a video interview with a doctor and they can ship it anywhere in the United States. If you’re outside the United States, I don’t know if Roman can help you or not. But uh, you know, if you’re looking for swinger insurance, you don’t want to talk to your doctor, they will interview with your doctor and give you a legit prescription right there over the internet, which is pretty wicked.


Mallory Gordon  33:04

And I’m sure there’s like prerequisites because obviously can’t be on me eyes or like have a heart problem.


Mickey Gordon  33:08

They actually asked you to go and get you need to have a recent checkup with blood pressure to make sure that your heart’s not going to explode the second your dick it’s hard. Yeah. Which, you know, sometimes I feel like my hair is gonna explode. So I’m so excited. But I’ll tell you, performance anxiety is a big deal. But the most important thing that I can tell you from what I have personally seen, get calm. The more anxious you get about it, the more worried you get about it, the worse it’s Oh, yeah,


Mallory Gordon  33:33

it’ll snowball. Yes, the worse that time is, it works in general. So


Mickey Gordon  33:37

that makes a lot of sense. So I suggest spending the time and by the way, you have a tongue, you have fingers, you have eyes, you have lips, use all of your tools


Mallory Gordon  33:47

that we were going to start seeing like a toddler song. They’re like, Head, shoulders, knees and toes,


Mickey Gordon  33:52

and no idea where you’re going to see lips acid tips. All right. Listen, you’ve got lots of ways to please that girl. So if you if if you’re one eyed Viper let you down, by all means, you know, fine. Yeah, go get some work. Don’t be scurred put your back into it. But so is worse than losing.


Mallory Gordon  34:13

Oh man. For me personally, it’s rejection. What if I’m not good enough? What if I’m not their type? What if there’s something about me that just that’s because it’s huge. It’s huge. And that’s that’s deep rooted inside of my own insecurities in it. It’ll pop its ugly head up.


Mickey Gordon  34:30

But rejection isn’t just I mean, because rejection can happen in a lot of levels.


Mallory Gordon  34:34

Sure it can happen in your your work life, you know, your personal life and the lifestyle


Mickey Gordon  34:39

record anywhere. And so our fear of rejection creates uncertainty, it creates doubt. Because we go well, they haven’t gotten back to me yet. They haven’t responded they it’s been a week and they must not like me, I must not be good enough. I must not be attractive. And so that is what social on you know different web platforms. It’s also in dating. Maybe like you go out, and you have some fun, and maybe they don’t get back to you. Maybe they don’t call you in the morning, then the next day.


Mallory Gordon  35:10

Yeah. That’s never happened to you. That’s not true. I’m sure somebody didn’t call me after. There’s no chance. They called you and said, Please, please, please. It was just traumatic for me. And then I put it out of my mind. I want to identify.


Mickey Gordon  35:25

Well, it’s happened to me. Goddamnit. But how about rejection? during sex? Like maybe?


Mallory Gordon  35:31

Just sound mash? Yeah, the chemistry is not there. like something’s off.


Mickey Gordon  35:35

As a guy. That’s something we think about like, is she going to be like, Look, this just isn’t working for me? Is she going to dry up? That’s a physical indication of rejection in your mind as a guy, that uncertainty that comes if she tries up and she’s not wet anymore. You’re like, Buck, I did something wrong. That’s a fear. Like we actually think about that shit. I don’t know. Guys, talk back to me here. Tell me what you think. But I mean, in my head. If she goes dry, I’m like, I mean, panic flags go.


Mallory Gordon  36:02

Well, I think it’s important to communicate like in those types of situations, because for me, sometimes it’s just a positioning issue. Sometimes I’ve had too much to drink. Sometimes. I haven’t had enough water. I get pretty wet down there. I’m not a squirter. But it after a long sessions it does to hydrate me. Or Yeah, I think you need to communicate to kind of overcome that obstacle. Yeah, well, you definitely put that fear. But that fear to rest? Um, something else? What do you think? Oh, yeah. Oh, God, STI is here, especially in the lifestyle fear. That


Mickey Gordon  36:37

is that is that is probably absolute terror. Right. I mean, and, you know, it’s funny. We were talking this week, you and I last night, as a matter of fact, at dinner about how cool would it be to find somebody that actually attended a key party?


Mallory Gordon  36:54

It would be very interesting, because you just don’t do it anymore. No. And I almost feel like it’s some this folklore now. Yeah, it’s like it’s like swinger really happen? Is that how they really did it? And how did that work?


Mickey Gordon  37:08

I’ll have to add, there’s a there’s a Twitter user out there called horrors of your, and they post like, yeah, there is, of course there is. And they post a lot of like old school photos and stuff, like from sex years past, and I should ask them about it. But the reason I bring up key parties is because I think those stopped in a way, in part, maybe due to the onset of I don’t know, consent would be a good thing. But the other thing is, STI is STDs. And there were a lot of them. Yeah,


Mallory Gordon  37:39

we were just talking about this the other day that that culture of like the the flower children in the 70s swinging and Studio 54 in the early 80s. And then AIDS epidemic head, and we didn’t know what it was, and it ensued panic. And I mean, it was first as identified as a homosexual issue now, right, like only gaming get this wrong. Yeah. Incorrect. Yeah. Incorrect, folks. Everyone, as generally, yeah. is potentially exposed. Yeah. It’s unfortunate. And by the way, maybe that was an effect.


Mickey Gordon  38:12

Yeah. Well, it’s a it really dramatically affected I think the way people interact. And I think it’s hilarious that even to this day, you know, people talk about, you know, condoms are a must No shit. Like, why don’t you don’t have to tell us? Yeah. I don’t think we probably shouldn’t be a thing like Ddf dragon disease free, which by the way, we’re going to talk about that one of these days, we’re going to do our kind of swing missionary, but drug and disease free. I should fucking hope so. Yeah. Because if you have something you should be telling your partners before they’re your partners. Yes. Let them make that decision for themselves even with a condom. Yeah, but STI is are a terrible, terrible, terrible fear. And that is a legit fear. That is not uncertainty that is not doubted is something you should be concerned about. Matter of fact, Cooper, from on swingset says he assumes that everybody has an STI when he plays with him. He just plays like he, he knows that. That is how he keeps himself safe. I mean, I personally find it a little extreme, but I think it’s genius.


Mallory Gordon  39:16

I you know, and the I think it’s practicing abstinence, which I would never succeed at non and a million years. But I think I think if you are going for optimal safety in these environments, then yeah, that’s the genius idea. Yeah, I think it’s I love what about physical safety? Oh, well, if you’re a hot wife, yeah. Which I have concerns about. I mean, I think, you know, if I’m meeting someone for the first time and I’m alone, or you know, I’m always concerned about where are we going? You know, is this a public places it in? You know, what part of town is it in? How far from home will I be? You know, all of those things, I think physical safety, especially from a female perspective is is definitely an should be a concern if you’re, you know, playing solo.


Mickey Gordon  40:07

Oh, yeah, very much. And I mean, that’s definitely something you’ve kicked around a little bit I


Mallory Gordon  40:12

  1. I think that’s something we’re revisiting here as of late, that’s on the table, or listeners posted on that. It’ll be fun. But


Mickey Gordon  40:21

you know, I think physical safety, personal safety, is it should be near the top for every lady out there. And I mean, that’s probably a good part of why they want to stay in the presence of their partner. But when you do get into that hot wife scene, is it appreciably different though, than being a single lady? And, and going out and dating?


Mallory Gordon  40:42

No, I don’t think so. It’s been so long. I mean, we’ve been together 12 years, so I haven’t really had the opportunity to revisit that dating. Like, as a single woman. Yeah, we’ve done a little bit of the hot wifing thing on this one. But there’s also been an established comfort level prior. Or you’ve been local. So no, I’m definitely approaching this currently, as a single girl. And I think that, you know,


Mickey Gordon  41:11

I’d be interested to hear what our listeners have to say on though, if they’ve been single female for and then also done how I think, is it different? I don’t think it is, I think you still you have been looking out for your own ass. That’s number one. And that is important. Right? You know, trust is an implicit?


Mallory Gordon  41:28

No, no,


Mickey Gordon  41:30

it’s earned. Yeah, it’s earned. And so I think that that is a big deal. What about pregnancy is a fear?


Mallory Gordon  41:37

I think it should be a legitimate fear. I mean, there’s, you know, people who play unprotected and maybe there’s an established comfort level again, but if you’re still in that, you know, physical state where it’s a potential Yeah, male or female should definitely be a concern.


Mickey Gordon  41:59

I think something I think it’s a very real concern. Matter of fact, there was a Reddit post today that somebody somebody asked they said, What in the world do you do if you get knocked out by somebody? That’s not your husband? Oh,


Mallory Gordon  42:13

shit. All Jerry Springer safe will come out of retirement. A lie detector and you are not the father. Yeah. She is. Whoa. No.


Mickey Gordon  42:29

It’s crazy. And I think about and it doesn’t fucking lewdly happens. I guarantee you it happens. It’s a terribly not to us. We’re cool. But it happens. And it happens. You know, broken condoms. Slip of, you know decorum. It happens because some guys are fucking douchebags. Yeah. So it happens. Don’t be a douchebag that’s my number one rule. That’s a rule for life. Don’t be a douchebag. But you know, so what are you what do you do about that? Play with people you trust build that trust level? Get to know them? Make sure they precaution you safe. Yeah, be safe. And by be safe. I mean, you know, you know, your comfort zone. And fear and uncertainty and doubt do contribute to a personal comfort zone. Don’t necessarily just go fuck it. It’s just fear. I don’t need to be afraid. Some things we do need to be afraid of personal safety. It is absolutely pregnancy. Yep. acknowledge them, but don’t make them the center of your universe. Right.


Mallory Gordon  43:27

Yeah, use common sense. Yeah.


Mickey Gordon  43:29

I mean, I think that that’s pretty much it. I think, you know, fear, uncertainty and doubt do slow us down. But sometimes it’s a good thing. I think, you know, having, you know, doubts about the intelligence of, you know, I don’t have a condom, well, then don’t do it.


Mallory Gordon  43:43

Right. Well, I think that kind of falls in line to you know, what I keep saying over and over again, they’re getting sick of me saying this the Is it true? Is it kind of is that necessary? Now is what is what I’m feeling real? Is this fear backed by something? Whether it’s historical or a past event? Or? Or is it? Is it caused by uncertainty? Um, can I discuss this with the people who support me and in intelligent and kind way instead of identifying, you know, something else that’s going on without really accessing the underlying issue? And do I need to pause and discuss this or deal with this? Because it’s necessary in this moment? Otherwise, I’m paralyzed by the fear, uncertainty or doubt.


Mickey Gordon  44:26

I think that brings us to our last one. Right, which is being yourself. Yeah, people are afraid to be themselves everywhere or nearly


Mallory Gordon  44:33

feared of yourself, like, we either put on a mask or you feed the background. I think those are two natural reactions when we’re scared that we won’t be accepted.


Mickey Gordon  44:44

That’s true. Right. And I gotta tell you, of all the fears we’ve talked about, that’s the one I think everybody needs to get over. They need to set it aside because your tribe is out there. And they if you find them in your yourself, because they’re what they’re looking for the same thing. somebody out there just like you.


Mallory Gordon  45:01

Exactly. I agree.


Mickey Gordon  45:03

You know, and it’s it’s so important that some of these fears we talked about today are totally legit. totally legit, you definitely should be aware of them. But the other ones, you know, like being yourself, you know, rejection, but not everybody’s everybody’s jam. Not everybody wants to be your best friend, not everybody wants to jump in. That’s cool. Enjoy.


Mallory Gordon  45:23

I mean, I think it makes us better people in general and in definitely much better than lifestyle. If you just acknowledge that. Not everybody’s gonna like each other. Try Not everyone’s gonna get along, and that’s okay. But that’s actually a


Mickey Gordon  45:36

good thing. When you do find the peanut butter to your jelly, you can smear it all over each other. Bad ads. Definitely, definitely recommend that you do that. And I don’t recommend using peanut butter. It takes a long time to lick off. But just say it does leave a residue to a little bit of breath. Oh, no butter breath when you’re trying to come not awesome. So you went there. Oh my god. But hey, we’re coming back with their last segment for today. That’s gonna wrap up Fudd. In our last segment, we have Jeff James adult film star, renaissance man artist with WWE j d coming your way. Why don’t you take us out Mallory tell everybody where they can find us and we’ll be right back.


Mallory Gordon  46:21

Awesome, guys. Well, you know, we’re casual swinger everywhere. That’s SLS SDC, Cassady Twitter, Instagram and Facebook. Please hit us up on our website at WWE casual swinger.com. And feel free to send us your feedback, comments and questions podcast at casual swinger Comm. That’ll do it. We’ll be back right after this. Hey, everybody, welcome back to casual swinger. I’m Mickey Mallory,


Mickey Gordon  47:10

and we have a special guest for you today. One of our favorites. We have Jeff James with us for a little segment we call what would Jeff do? wW. JD. Jeff, how you doing?


Jeff James  47:23

I’m excited. I’m excited. What Jeff’s gonna do? I don’t know. And all that stuff. Yeah. No, I’m still thank you guys so much for having me back.


Mallory Gordon  47:34

Oh, we love having you. Thanks for joining us. Yeah, no problem.


Mickey Gordon  47:39

This is gonna be kind of neat, right. So it’s the first time we’ve done this segment. And you know, today we talked about fear with our listeners, we talked about things like performance, anxiety, and STI is and pregnancy and physical safety. For people that are in the hot wave scene. We talked about a lot of things. But as a former adult film star, we thought maybe you would have some insight for us. So Valerie, why don’t you kind of tee it up for Jeff?


Mallory Gordon  48:07

Sure. Sure. So there’s a lot of pressure for men and porn and the lifestyle off in regards to performance. So since we talked about fear today, yeah, yeah, a lot of pressure there. Right. So any, any tips, tricks, or thoughts about, you know, the pressures that men have in this situation, the fear that exists? And how to address that?


Jeff James  48:31

Sure, yeah, absolutely. Um, all of these concerns are totally legitimate concerns, not only in the porn lifestyle, but you know, being important or make our living actually having sex. But in the lifestyle where we’re here for recreation, and friends, all of those things are definitely concerns. But let’s, let’s address the pressure. First of all, one thing that a lot of women never really wrap their head around is the amount of pressure that’s put on guys, from the get go from when we just start dating, when we start realizing that sex is going to be a big part of our life. That pressures not only put onto us, by women, but mostly by other men, or it’s a constant drilled into our head, you’ve got to be a stud. Oh, man, I went for two hours. You got to do better than that. And and our teachers and human sexuality classes really don’t go over what normal times are. Do you realize that a normal performance time for men is what 10 minutes, Aubrey is 10 minutes. That is a normal performance time for a normal human male in any sexual situation. Anything over 10 minutes girls, Count your blessings, your your your borrowed time, at that point. God be the guy that you truly are. So the thing is, is is, is as kids were always imagining these over amount of times they were supposed to be able to perform my god to please all the As women, and it’s not necessarily put onto us all the time by women, but by ourselves by our own egos, you know, we must hate our egos. And by other guys talking about, oh, I did this, I did that. It’s that whole, I caught a fish, it was this big routine, you know. It’s way beyond what is natural and or normal. So let’s talk about that pressure that we have. Well, guys, here’s the thing. When you’re in the lifestyle, and you’re with your girl, you’re with your lady, there’s somebody that you always know, you know, her, you’ve been with her, you understand her, you know how to push your buttons, she knows you, you’re comfortable. So the pressures off, you can relax, get that erection and be the God that you are for 12 and a half minutes, and I get that. So, but the problem that we have is when we interact with new couples, when we interact with new people, that performance xiety is rehashed all over again, here’s this couple we’ve talked to, we chatted him up at dinner, we met him at the club, we want to have sex with him, we want to play with him. So all of a sudden, you look over and your favorite lady in the whole world is with this guy who got this instant, big heart on. And he she’s just having the time of your life, you look at this wonderful other woman that you’re with, and nothing’s going on. Alright, so let’s address this. First of all, psychologically, a guy has to put himself into a situation, if the brains not working, the penis isn’t going with it. Okay, one is completely connected to the other. Most men don’t feel that way. Because they remember when they’re 17. And it had a brain of its own. Well, in our lives are like this, it doesn’t have a brain of its own. It’s connected to your head, if a guy’s not in a relaxed situation, and he can’t perform, it’s not going to happen. In porn, we call it over engineering, you’re over engineering and overthinking and erection. So how do you get rid of that? Well, yes, performance enhancing drugs help. But here’s the problem. When you take all of these different performance enhancing drugs, which I’m not going to say I like one or the other. But you know, the ones we’re talking about. They only work when your head’s in the right place, they only work if you’re going to be able to work in the first place, your doctor will tell you that. So you have to have your head of the utmost has to be in a good and comfortable place in order for all the other machinery to function. So how do you do that? Well, first of all, calm the fuck down, Excuse My French, calm down and put yourself in a good situation, put yourself in a calming situation, realize that these people already want to have an encounter with you. And you no longer need to really impress anybody, we’re not 17 anymore, that impression times are over with. So calm down and realize it’s going to work. Second of all, if you feel as though things aren’t working, you have to get your mind in that place. So this is how you do it. One, put your pants back on. I know it sounds strange, but it’s true. Find a pillow or comforter and put him away when he’s out of range, out of sight. And out of the out of the realm of everybody looking at him. And he’s in a warm and comfortable place. He’ll start to relax and work again. to it. It sounds like a puppy. Obviously, it sounds like a puppy. Puppy. Yeah. Sounds like a fluffy. Don’t scare the puppy, he’ll go back in the cage. So, calming down, put them in a warm place. What I always suggest is tell her you want to go down on her. Lay down, get into some oral sex, wrap your penis or your unit around in some nice pillow or something and forget about him. The minute you disconnect that pressure, he’ll start to react to the other things that are going on. Enjoy your partner’s parts. Enjoy the situation that’s going on. glance over and watch your the best porn in the world. featuring The one woman you love the most going on next to you enjoy that electricity that’s going on. disconnect from the pressure of having an erection then to if that doesn’t work. And I emphasize this in my swing one on one classes. Always take a play bag, a small bag of condoms, lube your favorite lube your favorite condoms. And then I always emphasize the sweet, some type of candy, not a breath mint necessarily, but some kind of candy. If it’s not working, reach inside your play bag and grab some candy. Scientific evidence will point over and over again. That when a man puts something sweet in his mouth, his tastebuds will override and disconnect from his penis. So the minute you put something sweet in your mouth, you’re comforting yourself, you’re putting yourself in a warm situation. That’s why we always have candy. It’s why we always have cookies. That’s why we always have sweets on the set of a porn movie. Because if you eat something sweet, it puts a guy back into his primal comfort space. So put something sweet inside of your mouth. And third, when that happens, and everything else is good, when you feel him start to come back, don’t do anything. Let him come back all the way. Too many guys jump the gun. When they start to feel an erection happen. They think they’re going to be able to perform. They whipped our little buddy out. She takes one Look, he goes right back in the hole and you’re back to start this square one. Wait until you achieve that full heart on before you reintroduce him into play time. How’s that? That’s fantastic. That’s fucking awesome. So eat more sweets get more pussy.


Mallory Gordon  55:54

You know, what do you think about that? Because when you when you eat sugar, you release like the dopamine and like all those positive, like receptors start firing. So I never thought of it that way. Yeah, it does.


Jeff James  56:08

And it will disconnect the guy’s pressure from thinking of having his brain connected to his penis, over engineering it because the more you think about it, the less it’s going to happen, the more you stress about it, the less it’s going to happen. So the less you think about it, all of a sudden, it just happens automatically by itself. And if you didn’t take any of those and hit porn performance enhancing drugs, that’s when they’re going to come in and help out a little bit to get that diamond cutter. So you can be the stud you are for your 12 and a half.


Mallory Gordon  56:38

I love that you just called a diamond cutter.


Jeff James  56:45

We call them that end point. It’s a diamond cutter, they can just slice your diamonds.


Mickey Gordon  56:51

Well, you know, obviously you’re hurting here, folks. That’s how you unfuck yourself because in reality that’s you’re really fucking yourself. And I think all of us guys know that. We’ve had it happen. If you say it’s never happened to you at all, you’re probably a liar. Everybody’s everybody’s had a struggle at some point. And honestly, it’s insurmountable for most of us because we don’t know what to do. It’s it gets in your headspace. And then it just gets worse and the panic ensues. Yeah, panic sets in fear sets in uncertainty sets in, you start to doubt yourself. And next thing you know, you’re jerking on a gummy worm by yourself in the corner, pissed off while everybody else is having a great time. That’s no fun. So you’ve changed that vibe. And you don’t want to do that. No, that’s no good. So tell me this. You were around before what we call swinger insurance or those performance enhancing drugs. Why? Why what did guys do before swinger insurance? I mean, what did you guys do back in the day,


Jeff James  57:48

back in the day when dinosaurs roamed the earth. All of us CRO Magnon man who came out of caves, making sure that we can get an erection sugar, sugar was a big deal. My favorite was a Snickers bar. And I hate to say, Central, but I do endorse that brand, when it fills my stomach up. So I don’t have to worry about being hungry, too. It stays with me for a long time. I’m going to be in some sugar for about an hour and a half. Two hours I need to get through this. I need that sugar high. Three, it gives me the chocolate that I need to make me feel good to make me feel good about what I’m doing. For me, it was always that or, or chocolate chip cookies, chocolate chip cookies were good peanut butter and jelly sandwich is my go to write every two a day. To a day,


Mickey Gordon  58:46

does that mean you give her 13 minutes of hot lemon?


Jeff James  58:49

Yeah, about 13 to 14 and a half minutes. Yeah. keeps her going for a while. But I do love having comfort food. If you feel as though you’re going to be in a situation whether you’re going to an all inclusive Jamaican resort, or whether you’re going to your favorite club, or whether you’re going someplace over to a house party, and you feel as though something’s going to happen and you’re going to try May I suggest a couple of things. One, never ever go into a party with the premonition of X, Y or Z happening. When you have that intense anticipation of full swap. If you have that intensification of a budget, you’re already like you said you’re already making it bad and they’re making it hard for yourself. Walk into a party walk into a place like that with the anticipation of I’m just going to have a good time and let it sneak up on you let it surprise you. Let that become spur of the moment. The erection is much easier. And to win do this make sure you have your comfort food available. Some, you know, stop the movie.


Mickey Gordon  1:00:03

Do you think drinking to excess is something that a mistake that people make when they’re nervous?


Jeff James  1:00:09

Yeah, can I say I can say certain things on this right? Anything you want, bro? Anything? Okay? Good. All right good. alcohols addict killer it was I mean it. Yeah, whiskey lake is something but alcohol and some guys were like why don’t drink whiskey so I don’t have to worry about it now here’s the thing. If you’re making your brain fuzzy, you can’t concentrate on your performance, you can’t perform the best of your ability. And the further your brain gets, the more your dicks just not going to work. So alcohol is a dead killer. If you want to drink, go ahead, have something to eat with it. Yeah, drink water, hydrate. Pace yourself, if you feel like you’re going to perform, perform, and now that I have the most beautiful woman in the world is part of my life. And Aubrey is is my soulmate. I don’t have to worry about it. But as a single guy in the lifestyle, I used to tell people all the time, they would say how can we get to play so much? And I would say I don’t drink. So when, at the end of the night, when you’re drunk as heck, and you’ve had too much, and your wife is ready, and you’re not? I am. So you’re just the last man standing. That’s the secret to your success. No, I’m the vulture on the tree branch waiting for you to drop.


Mickey Gordon  1:01:30

Fantastic. So that wraps up you know, talking about what Jeff would do and how to overcome performance anxiety, which is a huge fear for guys in the lifestyle. But I got a couple of things here. The sir first time having Jeff back, right, Mallory?


Mallory Gordon  1:01:43

Yes, it is.


Mickey Gordon  1:01:43

It’s our first time having Jeff back since we had them on a few a few weeks ago. And we’re so glad to have he and Aubrey here. They just released their personal art pages. So anybody that wants to go track these guys down and I’ll give you two seconds to tell people what your Art’s all about. But that’s no frame of reference on Instagram, and on Facebook. And that’s hashtag no frame of reference on loanword Yasser Graham all one word, but tell us what your arts all about real quick.


Jeff James  1:02:11

Thank you very much. Well, we Aubrey and I are both artists. And we love to paint we love to draw we illustrate not only we body painters love to paint your bodies and love to paint you when you’re around. But we also like to dabble in oil paintings and illustrations. So we want to put these things out there I, I myself, have been painting all my life and I was so afraid of putting my art out there because it’s such a personal thing. But Aubree is is my muse, she’s my everything. And she is she is told me countless times to put my stuff out there. So we’ve taken that step, we put it out there, we put no frame of reference, because we didn’t want to have a title that would confine us to a certain genre of art that we wanted to paint pictures of Dracula and pictures of flowers with no frame of reference. Now, Aubrey came up with the name and its diction. It’s perfect. But right now, I’m working on two separate series one, stories that frightened kids like Bloody Mary and the lady in white. And in fairy tale things that would scare us as kids, I’m actually illustrating them and putting them out. And I’m working on a series of oil paintings that are some of the most haunted objects in the world. Not only are we ghost chasers, Aubrey and I are into the science of ghost chasing. So we’ve taken that and put it in our art. And I have an oil painting series, I’m going to be releasing five I think there’s two or three on the series now of oil paintings of some of the most haunted, and some of the most scariest objects in the world that have just haunted people through the time. So go and go to no frame of reference, you can see these things, follow us on Facebook, follow us on Instagram, and you’ll see all these new illustrations coming up. And we’re also giving people a chance if you don’t want to buy the originals that will make prints for you. And you can actually purchase prints of the series and buy those prints for $20 each and we’ll send you the series, all of them autographed and numbered. So each one is a limited edition. So get them while you can. That is awesome. badass.


Mickey Gordon  1:04:17

I can’t wait for the next time we do one of these and you’re like and by the way, we’re opera singers now. You guys do everything that’s coming. Yeah, it’s coming. Coming soon. Literally. Coming soon. No, in 13 minutes. 14 and a half. I like to round up. Jeff, we’re gonna see you and how are we gonna see Aubrey in February.


Jeff James  1:04:42

Oh, God. Yes. You kidding. I’m not going without her.


Mickey Gordon  1:04:45

Yes, I did. So we’re gonna see you guys less than a month on the beaches of hedonism too, with our friends at Rachel’s rascals, but that about does it for what would Jeff do. Jeff, thank you for your time today. I hope everybody got as much out of that as we did because I always love Snickers and now I know that It was good for my dick to reach out to me gonna see a Snickers bar gonna get an erection. Alright Jeff, we’re gonna let you guys go, everybody. You’ve been listening to casual swinger.