WTFebruary & The Imposter Syndrome

WTFebruary & The Imposter Syndrome

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“Am I a swinger?”

“Do I belong here?”

“Am I DOING it wrong?”

We all ask ourselves questions that speak to the “Imposter Syndrome,” and yes…even us.  Sometimes you just don’t feel like you’re “doing it right,” for reasons that are often out of our own control.  Dont’ give into fear or peer pressure…join us on this weeks LONG overdue Casual Swinger where we tell you what happened that caused a huge lull in our podcast (most unexpected…COVID! ) and hear us talk about something near and dear to what’s been dragging Mickey down for weeks.

Also, Podcast-A-Palooza, Von Payne Whiskey, and of course FEBRUARY’s #Whiskeyofthemonth are all in this NEW Casual Swinger!

Von Payne Whiskey

Podcast A Palooza

Casual Toys

Bib & Tucker Bourbon

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ethically non monogamous, consensually non monogamous, imposter syndrome, fucking, swinger, people, whiskey, point, call, bourbon, lifestyle, casual, bottle, mallory, episode, talk, podcast, friends, couple, feelings, self, honestly, communication, fear, truth


Mickey Gordon, Mallory Gordon


Mallory Gordon  00:08

You’re listening to the casual swinger podcast. As your hosts we need to warn you that the material you’re about to hear may be sexual or explicit in nature. This podcast is intended for an adult audience. Now we don’t expect you to act like adults once the button that


Mickey Gordon  00:22

we’re a married couple living in Florida with over 13 years of experience in the lifestyle and we take almost nothing seriously. Casual speakers of variety show meaning we’ll cover everything from music to events, travel, and even the occasional hilarious screw up. Our show was about entertainment. We’re not licensed professionals had anything and her stories, commentary and guidance should not be confused the opinions of a licensed professional


Mallory Gordon  00:46

now that you know, let’s take those pants off and get comfy


Mickey Gordon  00:57

oh my god, welcome back. Finally, before the end of fucking time, welcome back to another episode of casual swinger. My name is Miki. Hey, you


Mallory Gordon  01:07

I’m Mallory.


Mickey Gordon  01:09

I feel like we have to reintroduce ourselves to everybody again. By the way, this is a podcast you guys have never heard before. Because it’s literally been over a month. Actually. We’re a month and a half late.


Mallory Gordon  01:20

Yeah, we just looked back in whiskey business last episode, and that was back in what


Mickey Gordon  01:23

middle of January end of January, January 24. Shit. So but still


Mallory Gordon  01:27

anyway. Hi, I’m Mallory. Copper. Fuck Mallory Gordon. I’m a Virgo. I like long walks on the beach


Mickey Gordon  01:32

whiskey. And a tongue in your butt.


Mallory Gordon  01:34

Yes. Usually. Yes, I do enjoy when somebody tongue punches my firebox.


Mickey Gordon  01:40

Oh, there’s a throwback. Yeah, shout out ray from euphoria Chronicles. who threatened to tongue punch your firebox at a event one time never


Mallory Gordon  01:48

forget it. As long as I live, I’ll get eyes all. Listen me. Alzheimer’s,


Mickey Gordon  01:52

did it. Do you know that’s like when you first met him, too?


Mallory Gordon  01:56

Yes, it did catch me off guard but memorable.


Mickey Gordon  01:59

I feel like that’s the way to make an impression on a woman just offered a tongue puncher fart box.


Mallory Gordon  02:03

Sure. It works 100% of the time.


Mickey Gordon  02:06

I forget you. Yeah. Like hey, by that time, I meant that sexual predator. Yeah. Anyway, so this episode is called WTF is in what the February in the imposter syndrome. But let’s talk about what the February.


Mallory Gordon  02:21

Yeah, so she I mean, we’re, we’re all about transparency and authenticity. So I think we need to be brutally honest here.


Mickey Gordon  02:28

Right? Like, what the fuck happened to February? Where did we go? I mean, I feel like I still sound a little raspy.


Mallory Gordon  02:34

A little bit. So, you know, a few things were going on for us. Um, you know, just putting it out there. We’ll start with we add a little case of writer’s block. Right.


Mickey Gordon  02:44

Yeah. I mean, I guess in a way, I guess I feel like some of that falls on me. Because I, you brought me so many good ideas for us to talk about when we sit down and kind of do our powwow sessions. And I just shit on everything I was I felt crappy. And it was just like, you have so many good ideas. And I just could not wrap my head around any of them.


Mallory Gordon  03:04

Yeah. And you know what, I think everyone, the human side of us, we all go through moments like that in our lives, where we’re in a slump. And there’s different influences that impact and give us that kind of result. And it’s actually better that we kind of you know, sequestered circle the wagons, whatever you want to call it and not aired that out. Yeah. And that makes sense. To


Mickey Gordon  03:25

be perfectly honest. I did have this episode that I had my heart set on doing. And the person that I wanted to bring on the show very, very politely and kindly declined and it broke my heart because I really wanted to do Yeah, but you still got a response. I did. So that’s I was very, very honored that he responded. What we’re talking about is Alan Isaac Minh, who is he was the he was Larry Flynn’s lawyer Larry Flynn’s lawyer who argued the case Falwell vs. Larry Flynt, in the Supreme Court in 1988, I wanted to talk about the First Amendment with him and he didn’t get back to us, which I really appreciated. But


Mallory Gordon  04:00

yeah, all I remembered about him until you gave me a little more backstory was that he was Larry Flynn’s lawyer. And the basis of that case was freedom of speech. Yeah, regarding penthouse,


Mickey Gordon  04:10

exactly. It was hustler. I sorry, I’m sorry, sir. At well, and it I mean, the whole thing was, it was a parody case, actually, it had less to do with adult entertainment than it did the right to mock a public official, when it’s obviously a joke. But what I wanted to talk about is, you know, some of the things that are going on out there in the world today and voluntarily giving up free speech despite you know, under the terms of you know, the canceled culture


Mallory Gordon  04:34

Yeah, I was gonna say censorship, censorship and canceled culture are definitely is something we’re seeing a lot more of yeah, they


Mickey Gordon  04:42

don’t have to. We’re doing it to ourselves. Yeah,


Mallory Gordon  04:44

it’s it’s very strange. Anyway,


Mickey Gordon  04:46

I really broke my heart I wanted to do that we’re gonna talk


Mallory Gordon  04:48

I know and then you know, the other part was you got really fucking sick. Oh my God really sick.


Mickey Gordon  04:54

Yeah, super sick. Like like, almost like we had been at keto sick. get really sick sometimes. What


Mallory Gordon  04:59

a double whammy. That was like you inherently. And I don’t mean to air your shit out there but like when you get respiratory illness, you’re down.


Mickey Gordon  05:08

Yeah, and I certainly can’t do a fucking talk here.


Mallory Gordon  05:11

You’re pretty much a cat’s hair away from pneumonia. You always freak out when I get sick though it will cuz you’re you’re my my kid my one that’s gonna go under fucking tree and just die and not tell anybody probably Yeah, I’m fine rub some dirt on it now but you couldn’t even talk you could barely speak


Mickey Gordon  05:29

no I couldn’t breathe and it was just bronchitis by the way guys, it wasn’t COVID At this time this is the thing that I know, for Chataway Yeah, literature they call this foreshadowing. But no, it was not COVID I checked, we took like three COVID tests, it was just straight up bronchitis, but the bitch of it was the doctors wouldn’t give me antibiotics.


Mallory Gordon  05:48

So in their defense, you know, it, especially for a viral infection and I’ll use air quotes there. You know, you don’t want to over prescribe antibiotics. Because when that happens, you become resistant to them at some point, right? We’ve we’ve created a culture where we were given antibiotics for total bullshit reasons.


Mickey Gordon  06:07

Well, yeah, but I don’t want to be sick for two goddamn weeks before they finally give me an ID right?


Mallory Gordon  06:12

It’s a great example of a culture that we live in. Because you do we do a lot of telemedicine that the value of in person, engagements with your doctor because I think that was a differentiator for you. And it took like two weeks for you to actually get the care and the therapies needed to get you through.


Mickey Gordon  06:29

Yeah, and I don’t think they can actually see how shitty I felt over telemedicine. I felt royally shitting, I finally had to call a doctor is a friend of ours. He’s actually been on the show before and be like, help me for Christ’s sakes. This sucks. So I got the antibiotic. Three days later, I feel right as rain, which is just in time for the corn Feds and a bunch of other friends that we


Mallory Gordon  06:46

had again, we had a house years. And it was like the best thing ever.


Mickey Gordon  06:50

And it happened right in the middle of this fuckery on the show


Mallory Gordon  06:53

now. Yeah. So you just started feeling better. Like we were like, ah, across the finish line, confetti and fanfare. Yay. And enjoying all this wonderful time with our friends, which it was absolutely incredible. My soul felt well fed. After that weekend,


Mickey Gordon  07:09

I felt like we were us again for like because we had not been us for a month. Right?


Mallory Gordon  07:14

I literally looked at myself in the mirror. What? Hey, me? It’s good to see you again.


Mickey Gordon  07:18

Yeah. And obviously having Derek and Jess here is just what I mean. I don’t know how else to put it except their family. I mean,


Mallory Gordon  07:26

they are they really are and other people if you’re around them and you’re not in a good mood that’s on you.


Mickey Gordon  07:31

Yeah, you obviously have a fucking problem. Yeah, if you’re not happy with them around. And of course we had a bunch of other folks who were friends from South Carolina. We had some more friends from Iowa here and friends from down the street. I think


Mallory Gordon  07:41

you owe school a couple of money by the way for that reference.


Mickey Gordon  07:43

Oh shit. Yeah, I do school couple called that shit. Damn it.


Mallory Gordon  07:47

Anyway, alright. So


Mickey Gordon  07:51

thanks for bringing that up. I’m saying him a beer. But anyway, the gist of it is one of them. One of these couples, one of the couples from Iowa. That is not Derek and Jess came here directly from hito which was


Mallory Gordon  08:04

amazing. By the way, they went on the rascals trip and came totally adjusted their plans to come see us


Mickey Gordon  08:09

right away. They did not have a flight out of here when they got here. Oh, I


Mallory Gordon  08:13

didn’t know that. Oh, get back die. Oh, we would have kept him forever. That’s fine.


Mickey Gordon  08:18

They are amazing. And they’re super cool. We actually really really really enjoy their company.


Mallory Gordon  08:21

Yeah. And friends from South Carolina. Yes, our friends are


Mickey Gordon  08:25

Lennar absolute hoot which they’re in the watersports business and the only reason I bring that up is because our neighbors that know that we’re swingers saw their truck that said watersports on it and come over in our lake. So is there some new shit you guys are into? You need to tell us?


Mallory Gordon  08:38

I didn’t even think about that’s great. That’s the


Mickey Gordon  08:42

mouth of the South in the neighborhood. So she probably told everybody we were getting pissed on here.


Mallory Gordon  08:46

Oh, no, it doesn’t say golden showers. It just said water sport and I think that’s the same thing she probably doesn’t know.


Mickey Gordon  08:52

I don’t know. She’s kind of a freak. She likes ball gags and shit. Remember?


Mallory Gordon  08:55

I don’t know that that says she’s a freak. Oh, she’s just into ball gags


Mickey Gordon  09:00

and shit. Anyway. Anyway, so yeah, they came in for a weekend here at the compound and we had a really good time. Except the folks that came from the rascal trip happened to bring COVID back from Jamaica. She Why don’t you just call them out? Well, they did. And you know, we’ve done it. We went on that trip. We got COVID A little fucked up


Mallory Gordon  09:19

that we we avoided going to you know, obviously mitigate our risk there. And then we don’t go we got it anyway. Now granted, thankfully. Knock on wood. It was a mild case for me. Yeah, it was beyond yourself. It was annoyance. You definitely got hit like a with a ton of fucking bricks


Mickey Gordon  09:38

just coming off. I haven’t bronchitis right days before right and


Mallory Gordon  09:41

your immune system was depressed and you’re a mess. Literally. It’s been almost two weeks. Yeah, yeah, it’s


Mickey Gordon  09:47

tested positive. Yeah. And


Mallory Gordon  09:50

I mean, your your bed at least you have a semblance of normalcy to where like, I don’t know you can breathe. Oh, yeah. Which is great. I’m


Mickey Gordon  09:58

gonna start working out again tomorrow. Bye. I really do think that it’s crazy how much different your immune system is than mine. Because I was literally just laying there feeling I was gonna die for days and days and days on end. And you were down for like a day and a half and then your being right back. Upstairs went out again. Yeah,


Mallory Gordon  10:16

it was like three four days. I


Mickey Gordon  10:17

swear to God, you’re a cyborg?


Mallory Gordon  10:19

Maybe I am.


Mickey Gordon  10:20

I don’t know your your fuck bot 3000


Mallory Gordon  10:22

That’s you know, I will say that my immune system got a lot better when I quit smoking. Which by the way, it’s gonna be a year, but yeah, gratulations to me


Mickey Gordon  10:31

get a big round of applause for her friend Mallory. No,


Mallory Gordon  10:35

  1. Did you but not work? No, I missed the button of all the times for you not to hit the buttons. I was actually encouraging that. Okay, here it goes. Thank you


Mickey Gordon  10:50

round of applause but you know, I do you think that it was amazing, and it sucked. And that’s really kind of what happened guys. We just got sick, and then got sick again. And and of course, it was just a just confluence of events. I hope you guys forgive us and hang out and enjoy the rest of the show. Yeah, we got a lot to


Mallory Gordon  11:09

talk about if you know if you’re still here. Thanks for hanging in there.


Mickey Gordon  11:12

Yeah, right. Thanks for not abandoning ship. Hey, let’s talk about PCAP real quick. Yeah, get on 90% sold out.


Mallory Gordon  11:18

Yes. And I oh my god, I’m so excited. I started shopping for my theme night outfits. And I can’t fucking wait. Some of it’s a little left up to interpretation. I think I’m gonna take a weird spin on it. But I’m still fucking jazzed about


Mickey Gordon  11:28

what we do. PCAP in Miami and I did not go full Don Johnson but I’m doing it for this. Oh, man in suit. Maybe


Mallory Gordon  11:34

I think you just oh, I’m my I can feel my heart rate increasing because I’m so excited about it. And this is no bullshit. It may be my favorite lifestyle event. But not maybe it is mine. It’s it’s so hard not to chalk it up to that because not only do we get to see some of you know, our favorite humans that we’ve come to know especially over social media over time. We always get to meet new people. The events are always on point. The extras are on point Kate always keeps something under her hat is an element of surprise. Like the burlesque dancer at the gala night. Like that was fucking amazing. And like half the people have never seen a burlesque show. Count me among them. Yeah, I know. I was so shocked and like we’ve been together 16 years. You’ve never seen a brush show? Oh, probably


Mickey Gordon  12:11

because I didn’t know what the fuck it was. So I didn’t go in. Yeah, so


Mallory Gordon  12:14

anyways, I digress again. I’m just totally pumped. So we hope um, if you’re listening, and you’re thinking about summer plans, please consider joining us at podcast Palooza in Palm Springs. Yeah,


Mickey Gordon  12:26

it’s in Palm Springs, California. That is the Gulf capital of the universe. If you guys aren’t aware of it, it’ll be the swinger capital for a weekend, right. I can’t tell you which hotel it is. But I’m telling you right now it’s the biggest hotel we’ve ever done. PCAP at there are a bunch of new folks that just got added. Right folks like for our play and swinger University. Just got added if you haven’t checked out their shows, make sure to go check them out. You know, for our plays pretty interesting. They’re very youngness when your podcast I think they’re both barely 30 years old. Oh my gosh, they’re kind of you know, talking to a different generation there, which I think might be kind of cool.


Mallory Gordon  12:58

Hey, I’m an elder millennial, like, you’re not totally I mean, well, maybe they’re separate from my generation, but well, we’ll


Mickey Gordon  13:05

probably get into it more next episode, but I got new glasses, so I’m feeling extra old. I look like a fucking English professor. Hey,


Mallory Gordon  13:11

that’s fucking hot. By the way. For some people for your wife. It was helpful. All the hot chicks that want to bang you. That’s like, come on. Anyway, back to PCAP. So like, all the shit that’s gonna go on not only the theme nights, parties, like topless pool party. Oh, my God. Yeah. Which is something we had me at Miami. That was fantastic.


Mickey Gordon  13:32

And we’re kind of known for the crazy shit we do during pool parties.


Mallory Gordon  13:35

I don’t know what you’re talking about. I am demure and well behaved. And I just want


Mickey Gordon  13:39

to point out that Jay from ever stringers will be there. And when we have a pool party, and we’re emceeing a pool party, and J shows up wacky Shit happens.


Mallory Gordon  13:46

Oh my gosh. mankini all I’m gonna say is him and his mankini. That’s right, chicken, Mac United calm worth the cost of entry.


Mickey Gordon  13:55

Well, hey, if you don’t know about it, it’s podcast, dash a dash Palooza calm, but I’m guessing you live under a rock. If you haven’t heard of that by now. Don’t miss this. It is going to be absolutely fantastic. And we would appreciate you guys supporting it. We’re gonna run a little long in the intro today, guys, because we missed you so much.


Mallory Gordon  14:12

I’m sorry. I’ll hustle it up.


Mickey Gordon  14:14

You gotta hustle shit. I just want you guys. We’re doing that on purpose a little bit today. But okay, let’s talk about our new partnership because we do have a new partnership that is leading into something we’re going to talk


Mallory Gordon  14:23

about, Gosh, this is so cool. And I was I’m not gonna lie. I was a little skeptical about the conversation when it started, right. But more to come to this. We started down the road partnering with a whiskey brand right here in Florida. Vaughn pain whiskey.


Mickey Gordon  14:35

Yeah, that’s right. These guys reached out to us and I went down and met with them a few weeks ago. It was in the low right between COVID and bronchitis. And I managed to go meet with the CEO and I was really impressed with really where they were headed with the brand they’re targeting the lifestyle for their brand


Mallory Gordon  14:52

there. What I love is that it’s targeting they’re embracing your lifestyle right they these, I guess alternative material lifestyles, the alternative lifestyles on alternative markets, right? They’re being very intentional with their marketing. And I actually fucking love that about them because they’re like, this is not just for the mainstream this is, this is a whiskey that’s very different than anything else that’s out there on the market. So they’re marketing to different, quote unquote, different people. And I fucking love that. And it’s delicious.


Mickey Gordon  15:20

It actually really is. And I think the people that are gonna love on being whiskey or the people that don’t already like whiskey,


Mallory Gordon  15:26

I think it’s a good entry into whiskey. And I think as long as you are comfortable with the flavor profile, even if you do like whiskey, just knowing what it is. You should be good with it because it makes an outstanding old fashioned with zero added sugar. That’s right, start there. None. And it’s, it’s very neat. The flavor and Can I can I give more detail about


Mickey Gordon  15:46

it ahead. I mean, at some point, if he drops the price on it, it might be whiskey of the month, but it won’t be anytime soon.


Mallory Gordon  15:50

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it’s, it’s not totally out of range, but it’s it’s up there.


Mickey Gordon  15:54

It’s it’s above 4999. Yes. But it’s


Mallory Gordon  15:57

it’s a current. Yeah, black current black currant whiskey, which sounds strange, but you know, current Isn’t that reason deep family. Right. It’s got a very unique flavor. It’s sweet without being overpowering. It’s not super sticky. So it is like a flavored whiskey but it hasn’t regular proof of 90. Right. So it’s up there, but it does not burn. It’s very, very smooth. And it’s


Mickey Gordon  16:21

made from a seven year bourbon. Yeah. So it’s just absolutely outstanding. We’re talking about this not because and by the way, yet again, we have a partner of casual swinger that we don’t take money from we’re not exchanging money with these guys. We’re talking about them because it’s really fucking good. It is. I


Mallory Gordon  16:36

didn’t want to fucking like it cuz I don’t like flavored whiskey. Yeah.


Mickey Gordon  16:39

Let me tell you what happened. Right. So we had all these people in our house, right? I think we had like 14 or 16 people here.


Mallory Gordon  16:45

I mean, we had invited locals. Yeah, that’s true.


Mickey Gordon  16:47

I had six bottles. I have one bottle left. We went through five bottles of whiskey in a day and a half. That’s how much people like Vaughn. Maybe we


Mallory Gordon  16:57

need a meeting. And


Mickey Gordon  16:59

it was a friend’s life or boy, it


Mallory Gordon  17:01

was definitely good. So we’re really excited to talk more. There’s a few things in the works, including the casual cocktail. That’s exciting.


Mickey Gordon  17:10

Yeah. So keeping keep your eyes open and your ears peeled for the casual cocktail. I love it. Yeah, it’s coming.


Mallory Gordon  17:18

You know what I’m super excited about? What’s that? 30 days of lingerie.


Mickey Gordon  17:21

You better be excited because we had a lot of work to do.


Mallory Gordon  17:23

Oh my god, I’ve already started picking up my outfits and I can’t fucking wait. Oh, this is gonna


Mickey Gordon  17:27

be a fucking shit show.


Mallory Gordon  17:28

It’s gonna be are you kidding me? Oh,


Mickey Gordon  17:30

how many photos I’m gonna have to Edit.


Mallory Gordon  17:32

Edit. Are you kidding me? I naturally


Mickey Gordon  17:35

you are beautiful. But what I mean, sir, we I tell people this all the time. The only editing I do to Mallory’s photos. I put them on brand for us. Because we do have a very specific photo style


Mallory Gordon  17:45

that Yeah, and I think you’re like, you don’t want people posing as me? No.


Mickey Gordon  17:49

So I watermarking. But I also take your tattoos out. Oh, that’s true. Yeah, a lot of people don’t know have tattoos? Yeah, when I do that, because they’re personally identifying marks. And if somebody does deal with your photos, I don’t want it to be personally identifying for you. So other than that, I don’t edit your photos.


Mallory Gordon  18:01

Yeah, that’s true. But I do feel myself Khan’s competence in the month of April skyrockets because of this exercise. So thank you, Kate. A wanderlust.


Mickey Gordon  18:09

Yeah, this is gonna be really, really cool. So by the way, that is hashtag 30 days. Andre on Twitter. If you’re not looking for that starting April 1, you should be because some of the Sexiest Women on this planet are going to be posting pictures of myself. That’s


Mallory Gordon  18:21

like masturbatory, I can’t wait. Yeah, I’m that pervert.


Mickey Gordon  18:24

And all of our ambassadors at casual toys calm are going to be participating. So pay attention to what those ladies are doing. Very excited about


Mallory Gordon  18:33

that. I won’t be able to help it. I love the alley in


Mickey Gordon  18:37

the Pepe pineapple on honey spoon. Hmm. All kinds of good stuff going on there. Alright, so what else we got? We got one lesson. This is actually what we’re going to talk about today on the episode.


Mallory Gordon  18:49

Yes. So let’s let’s really get into the meat of this. I think we touched on just a wee bit an intro here. So we would have been just a wee little bit, we’re gonna talk about the imposter syndrome. And this, this may be very relatable from a you know, human perspective. And when we put it into context here, you know, you ever feel like a bad swinger? I do. Yeah, we did. Do


Mickey Gordon  19:11

all the time. Yeah. For the last, I don’t know, a month and a half. And we’ve been living in a hole.


Mallory Gordon  19:15

Yeah. So we’re gonna dig into that today. You know, we did have a great time of their friends. But you know, how it left us feeling? Like, maybe we’re missing the ball on something. I mean, what, what’s your takeaway? I mean, I felt a little bit like an imposter.


Mickey Gordon  19:31

I bet. I often feel that way. And again, we’ll talk about that here in a few but especially when we have everybody here and we’re entertaining and we’ve got folks around and we have every reason and every opportunity to play, but we don’t.


Mallory Gordon  19:46

Or at least to ask Yeah, we didn’t even as we’re so


Mickey Gordon  19:48

busy doing what we do that maybe I wonder how many people ask themselves Am I doing it right because somebody else does it differently. And am I imposter because Don’t so we’re gonna talk about that here in a couple of minutes. But before we do Mallory is going to for the first time in quite a while, tell everybody how to find


Mallory Gordon  20:08

  1. Oh shit, I forgot who he is.


Mickey Gordon  20:10

That’s the left memory.


Mallory Gordon  20:12

All right, go. And we are casual swinger everywhere you can find us a casual Feel free to shoot us a message or questions at podcasts that casual like us would like to say something nice. Please feel free to say that on you know, Apple podcasts or Apple music wherever the fucking podcast live is a fucking flag in your for everyone to do. Yeah, but if it’s negative, just keep that to your fucking self. You should. And we’re also on social media. That’s Facebook, Twitter, YouTube and Instagram. And you can also find us on the dating sites. It’s STC SLS Cassidy and Doubleday nation.


Mickey Gordon  20:46

How could you literally forget that?


Mallory Gordon  20:48

I didn’t forget it. I was pausing for dramatic effect.


Mickey Gordon  20:51

Oh, it was very dramatic.


Mallory Gordon  20:52

Yeah, no,


Mickey Gordon  20:53

I gotta tell you, I there’s no chance I would have been able to do that after not doing it for a month and a half. Like you just


Mallory Gordon  20:57

did actually sat here stressing over the last 15 minutes. Is that why your palms are


Mickey Gordon  21:01

sweaty? knees weak palms are sweaty. Gross. Disgusting, guys. We’ll be back in just a second even listening to


Mallory Gordon  21:12

a trailer park rolls around the outside and we’re back. Welcome back is what I’m supposed to do. That’s the second part. Right? Yeah,


Mickey Gordon  21:35

I did the Welcome Back thing in the beginning too. Cuz I figured anybody that’s coming back is literally coming back from a long second break.


Mallory Gordon  21:40

Hi, it’s still casual swinger. Oh, yeah. And it’s not been another month. No, hi


Mickey Gordon  21:45

only been literally like 30 seconds. This is the shortest break ever. Love it. We call it the next episode. That would save us some time.


Mallory Gordon  21:52

Oh, I feel like now I need the Dr. Dre music


Mickey Gordon  21:54

to guess next up. So yeah.


Mallory Gordon  21:57

So let’s let’s get into imposter syndrome. I think we need to give the folks listening a little background on what it is exactly. So imposter syndrome is the idea that when you have a lapse in activity that maybe you’re not like in the lifestyle anymore, or that maybe you don’t belong in groups or parties that used to attend or whatever reason, you start asking yourself different questions. Right. And I think that’s kind of the context we’re living in as far as the application of it right now.


Mickey Gordon  22:25

I think certainly, for us, yes. But I think it’s also, you know, when you go somewhere to a party, or to an event or to a club, and everybody, for example, let’s say, you know, 11 o’clock rolls around in the dance floor is half as full as it was an hour ago. And you go out to everybody go, well, everybody went to the play room, and you go, Oh, well, that’s not us. We don’t want to go to the play room. Does that mean you don’t belong there? Are we good? swingers? Are we are we really? Are we actually can we call ourselves swingers? I haven’t we don’t do what everybody else is doing.


Mallory Gordon  23:01

I mean, how the fuck do you even define that though? Like, what is a good swinger?


Mickey Gordon  23:06

Well, and that’s just it. No one can define that for you, right? I mean, I mean, are we supposed to sit around asking ourselves questions like, how often are we supposed to play and still be able to call ourselves ethically non monogamous consensually, non monogamous swingers lifestyle, whatever you want to call them? There’s so many goddamn labels out there. Do I get to call myself this stuff? If if I don’t do the style of play that everybody else is doing?


Mallory Gordon  23:31

I think those are valid questions. And I’m going to go ahead and just burst my own little bubble here. Because I really feel that that comes from a place where I’m concerned about what my peers think. And that they will feel like I’m an outsider, an outcast, which goes back to fear, right? False Evidence Appearing Real. You know, we’ve talked about that before. But I’m hyper aware of that in environments where I’m in an all anomaly, or the PAC is moving in one direction. And I’m either you know, stationary or willing to move in a different one. I’m very comfortable in the decisions I make. But there comes a point where you start to question that and go, Okay, who, who has visibility to this? And how much are they noticing? Are they qualifying me in the process? Yeah, that’s what


Mickey Gordon  24:20

starts in middle school.


Mallory Gordon  24:21

Hell yeah, does


Mickey Gordon  24:22

right. There’s the cool kids, right? It’s the kids got the money to kids dress nice to kids that have you know, maybe on the cheerleading squad or play sports and they all happen


Mallory Gordon  24:29

way before that, but it just becomes a little more prominent more vocalized, I think,


Mickey Gordon  24:33

right? And so let’s say that, you know, these cool kids, you see these cool kids and then you get in the club, you start getting invited to parties. You start getting to hang out by the lockers, you get notes you get in that note club, right? We start getting


Mallory Gordon  24:51

the notes anymore, but yeah,


Mickey Gordon  24:52

text and Snapchat and ship or tick tock or whatever the fuck it is, you guys do notice, you don’t whippersnappers. But You know, the the trick here is once you’re in a club, the scariest thing in the world is getting kicked out of it. Agreed. I think that’s something that a lot of people worry about in, am I being noticed by my peers for things that I don’t want to be noticed for, like a lack of activity, like getting invited to a playroom by beautiful people. And declining? Yeah. When people look at you and go, you have no fucking reason to say no, here. Everyone wants to be you right now. And you’re declining. So what happens? I mean, how do you? How do we had I had you? I mean, I don’t know how anyone reconciles this without feeling like they’re doing it wrong,


Mallory Gordon  25:42

right. And we’ve actually had to answer for, for that specific example that you gave, like, people have questioned us because of that. And I understand that they would do it differently. I’m almost offended that they feel so entitled to, to have that opinion, so openly and publicly. And maybe they don’t realize the negative connotations that I had to it.


Mickey Gordon  26:08

But there’s also their side of it, which is why am I not good enough for you?


Mallory Gordon  26:12

Yeah, that’s true. And I, I would never want anyone to feel like they’re not good enough. Like that’s awful, like, politely declining is very, very difficult. But you also don’t want me to say yes, just because it’s very fucking obvious. No luck and poker face.


Mickey Gordon  26:29

No, definitely don’t have a poker face. But I think that it’s worth mentioning here. That it doesn’t matter which side of this you’re on. If the answer is not, yes, you’re probably gonna feel weird about it. It’s pretty common.


Mallory Gordon  26:43

Yeah, no, you’re not wrong. You’re not wrong. And I think we’re very, incredibly fortunate to have had opportunities right there on the table at our fingertips. And the slight decline comes into play. And it does make me wonder, like, how rusty Am I at this point? Does that makes sense? Like, who am I actually say yes


Mickey Gordon  27:09

to him? I haven’t talked to a microphone in like a month and a half I feel as Rusty is an old bicycle. It’s been left outside since


Mallory Gordon  27:16

but I also met and you know, please situation like that.


Mickey Gordon  27:19

Either to play room in probably four years that I wasn’t doing pictures are like journalism shit for?


Mallory Gordon  27:26

Yeah, I think you I think the last time we were in a play room. Yeah, no, you’re right. It’s probably it was pre COVID.


Mickey Gordon  27:31

Kenya was nothing against player and it’s just not usually we do.


Mallory Gordon  27:34

Yeah. So I guess I’m a germaphobe. I get skeeved out by lots of people. When the whole like group dynamic, the orgy thing is just not my scene. And I think I internalize a fear that I have about someone on wanting lay like coming over and that’s not fair. Like we


Mickey Gordon  27:49

Slifer I remember. We were at Hedo in the playroom and it was just you and I and we wanted to bang under the stars and mosquitoes bet us on the air. It was


Mallory Gordon  27:58

hilarious. He got beat on the balls. I did and yeah, yeah, it’s itchy team for like three days. It was really like, you can’t do that here. Because people are gonna think you got crabs. Well,


Mickey Gordon  28:08

motherfucker. They could see if I had crabs at that point. And I don’t have any any pubic hair. But one hair on my ass crack that I missed. I’d have like 12 Crabs hanging out on it. What’s up?


Mallory Gordon  28:18

But I mean, I think going back to my statement of just having inherent fear of being in a situation I don’t want to be in it’s, again, probably not reasonable. Knowing the environments we put ourselves in it just I haven’t mentally gotten over that hump.


Mickey Gordon  28:36

You just said a word that I think matters, which is reasonable. Fear is not reasonable. Of course


Mallory Gordon  28:42

it isn’t. It’s mental chatter. It’s a monster in there. You know, there’s no


Mickey Gordon  28:46

reasonable. And these, when we talk about the imposter syndrome, what we’re really talking about is a fear that my activity, my actions, or my lack thereof, will render me outside of the circles that I very much desire to be in.


Mallory Gordon  29:06

Yeah, I think one of the most hurtful things that happens to people in social situations is not love or hate necessarily, because that takes a lot of passionate investment to feel those things. It’s indifference, right? I would hate to feel have people feel indifferent towards me, especially people I care about?


Mickey Gordon  29:26

Well, and I think part of what scares me about it, and this is just me kind of opening my kimono a little bit. Not that I don’t do that for you guys all the time. But, you know, the truth is, we have these long lols in our interactions with other couples. And you know, I mean, this week couple weekends ago is a good example. I feel further and further from the lifestyle personally. And that’s the that I mean, COVID didn’t help right that definitely not I felt further and further from life there for a while, but my self imposed ban on secrets has not helped right now that’s


Mallory Gordon  29:59

true from a culture perspective where we live. That’s a that’s the hotbed, right that is where the the local swingers and the traveling swingers go to congregate and it’s just not something we’ve want. We’re participating in, right? It’s


Mickey Gordon  30:10

every time friends come to visit now they’re like, Hey, we’re going to secret somebody yet. I’m not. So that hasn’t helped.


Mallory Gordon  30:16

Now, would it be fair to say that, you know, all of this kind of feels like everything you’re doing might be making it worse?


Mickey Gordon  30:22

Yeah. It’s kind of like, kind of like quicksand. Right, which I mean, as a child, I was led to believe that quicksand would be a much bigger problem than it’s been for me as an adult and anvils. Right, yeah. anvils from the sky. That was definitely never even seen an anvil by the way, yet quicksand all my traipsing through the woods, but no, it kind of feels like I don’t know, maybe the less we talk about something, the more we think about what the other person is thinking or feeling. And maybe it generates reactions inside yourself as if they’re real, as if the other person’s saying what you’re afraid they’re thinking.


Mallory Gordon  30:55

Okay, so the lack of dealing with it or pulling it out or bringing it to the forefront and having conversations around it, you feel is attributing to the additional, I call it mental chatter, right? Those Those nasty little negative voices in the back of your mind. And then it’s assigning these emotions and feelings that may or may not be real in the first place.


Mickey Gordon  31:12

Yeah, like, I’ll be sitting in here, and I’ll go well, and we haven’t talked to a couple in a while. We haven’t been out in a while. We haven’t gotten done anything in a while. Well, Mallory really doesn’t want to anyway.


Mallory Gordon  31:20

Yeah, you’re not allowed to talk for me.


Mickey Gordon  31:22

Whatever. My brain what to do. It does what it wants.


Mallory Gordon  31:26

Your brains a misogynist little fuck.


Mickey Gordon  31:28

Yeah, but it’s dirty, too.


Mallory Gordon  31:30

Yeah, that’s, I like that part.


Mickey Gordon  31:32

What about when we say things like, well, we’re so busy with our time to meet other couples? I think we both been guilty of saying that


Mallory Gordon  31:37

I think we have and I think that’s us having our head and harasses, you know, we, yes, our lives have this complication, ebb and flow, which I’m sure does not make us any different than anyone out there in the universe. But we allow these complications to infiltrate the personal time in our lives, to where we’re not intentionally choosing to go do those activities. So it’s easily excused by Oh, I’m just too tired, or I’m so busy. And oh, I have this checklist of things to do. And let’s be fucking honest. I get hit by a bus tomorrow, there’s like a checklist items are still gonna be there. So what is the actual harm unintentionally planning and carving out time to be those parts of ourselves when we can


Mickey Gordon  32:18

I have a problem. I think when it comes when we start to get into these lols, that kind of almost really self fulfills my imposter syndrome. And we’re going to talk about it more next episode, because I think this is a much deeper subject than we have time for, especially given we had a nice long lead in today. But I’m not good enough. And I don’t think I should reach out to these folks, or try to inject ourselves into the situation.


Mallory Gordon  32:49

I think I see that. I can relate to that. I think it haunts you a little more than it does me and I do


Mickey Gordon  32:59

not as fuck, that doesn’t don’t.


Mallory Gordon  33:03

I feel the same way when I look at you. So I don’t think that’s fair. However, in those situations, I can understand where that’s coming from. But I have seen it become almost debilitating in the social application applications, right? You allow it to speak for you and you make decisions for other people, which I’m going to go ahead and just actually say from their perspective, that actually might be rude. You’re not allowed to speak for someone else, if they’re going to have a negative reaction, you have to be vulnerable, and also solid enough to take those negative reactions, but at least allow them to have it, you know that there is a risk involved in these environments. And we’re not going to be everybody’s cup of tea. And I think we’re actually more okay with that than we are. At this point. I almost need to say it like trying, you’ve already made we’ve already put up that blockade. You’re saying I’m not good enough, so I’m not going to move forward. So it makes you stagnant stationary, which just I think


Mickey Gordon  34:05

I usually talked about this for I usually send the message that I’m not interested. I know easier than being told no.


Mallory Gordon  34:13

Which is so strange. Yeah, it’s strange. And I find myself as your partner, struggling to find ways to help encourage you, but also give you the space you need to work through that. You know, to be supportive, and your cheerleader and build you up from a confidence perspective. But it also goes back to like happiness is really self propelled. I just fear, right? I can do, I can create the environment for you. But you have to choose that path. You have to want to be happy. You create, you’re happy. I can give you the tools. I can support you but I can’t necessarily make you feel it. Does that make sense? Yeah. Am I talking about a mass?


Mickey Gordon  34:56

Well, no, you’re not. I mean, I think it’s I think so. Most of these things we’re talking about can become intensely and deeply personal very quickly. I mean, especially when we start talking about fear, because it stacks up fear is this just self fulfilling monster that when you focus on it, I mean, I, it’s one of the few times of a man bun. So I really can’t do this a lot. But when I quote Nietzsche, for example, and I say that when you stare into the darkness long enough, eventually it’ll stare back at you. Mm hmm.


Mallory Gordon  35:25

And this is what got you laid, by the way. Yep. 100%. This in the 80? Stripped album?


Mickey Gordon  35:31

Oh, that was a good one. Yeah, yeah, pulled some music out of my tail for that one. But I honestly think that when we really focus on asking ourselves questions, where the only answer is driven by something you can’t control. When I’m asking questions, where the answer is something I have no control over. And I try to create answers for the thing I have no control over, it’s almost never going to be good. Unless you’re this wildly positive narcissist that thinks that nothing bad can ever happen to you. And that everybody loves you and everything. I mean, I only know one person like that, and that Sheila it’s it, everything is perfect. Everyone loves me, no one could possibly not like me, and everything’s gonna be great forever. I just don’t know, people that think that way. So when you start asking these questions and focusing on these things, the reality is, it can happen to anybody, the imposter syndrome can set in and make you feel like you don’t belong. And I think it can happen to anybody, anywhere, anytime. And in my case, I’ve got a case going on. Because, you know, throughout this gap, and our show, February was brutal for that shit.


Mallory Gordon  36:39

It was, and the longer every week that went by, that we didn’t record I could see it weighed heavily on you, because you know, we do this because we enjoy it. But I could see like, you felt like you were letting people down. You were letting yourself down. You felt like you were letting me down or listeners down. And I love that about you. And I’m sure our listeners will will agree. You know, the the show isn’t tailored for an audience per se. Like we don’t custom make this for demand and notoriety. We do it because sharing some of these experiences hopefully might help somebody maybe not. Maybe it’s just a little funny to hang out with us. Or maybe everybody has DVD overlays. Maybe they hopefully mock us and that makes their day like Who gives a fuck I do some dumb shit. At the same time we do this because we in in as a couple enjoy it. No,


Mickey Gordon  37:33

I think that’s definitely true. But


Mallory Gordon  37:35

it weighed heavily on you. And I think the further out I got the worse I got. We had it you and I had a very candid conversation. And I was I was legitimately concerned that you were going to throw in the towel just because at that point, you felt like there was no point of like a point of no return. And I’m over here going. It’s our motherfucking narrative like we have total control over this. It’s fine,


Mickey Gordon  37:58

guys. I’d like to just point out just for a moment, that Mallory’s vocabulary when she says that we had a candid conversation what she means is we were yelling at each other


Mallory Gordon  38:10

Wow, look at you. You know I got in trouble for doing that. What you really mean is I’m not allowed to do that. So you can’t flip the script on me and use my tools.


Mickey Gordon  38:19

Well, I’m just saying that I was getting my ass chewed because I had my head my ass because my confidence was in the shitter


Mallory Gordon  38:26

and I’m sorry for that. I’m sorry for that. But you know my methodology. I give you a wide berth and I show you love and I show you support and I give you the soft side I give you the soft side. And but there comes a point where mama has to put her foot down and go enough’s enough I’ve babied you I’ve coddled you I’ve supported you and it’s just getting worse so let’s get our big fucking girl panties on pull up our bootstraps and figure this shit out


Mickey Gordon  38:52

combat boots Yeah, yeah, I’m just come on you do


Mallory Gordon  38:55

it for me.


Mickey Gordon  38:56

And probably actually, I have. But you know, I think our time has been so limited with the new jobs and the stress that’s come from the new gigs and I think it’s just kind of infiltrated into other aspects of our lives and not not actually pointing just at myself here I think you to


Mallory Gordon  39:13

Yeah, no, absolutely. I 100% Again, relate. I do see this as a little more of an outlet for me. But my confidence like providing additional like this episode was primarily or orchestrated by you and I felt more confident about recording it knowing that you had the reins on that because a little hesitant he did poopoo my ideas so like I’m a little reserved about providing that kind of feedback and feedback until like there’s a we got this one under the belt and then yeah, I’ll have my confidence


Mickey Gordon  39:49

episode in the next one. I are kind of laying me on the table for the room right so I’m sorry, I’m just saying that you know what, what coming what what came this time that you guys are hearing and next time I swear to God, I’m literally going to record an episode of circus clowns or something after these two episodes because I feel like they’re heavy and heavy scares me.


Mallory Gordon  40:10

Heavy scares me too. But I think it’s valuable information because as a society, we have been conditioned to not call out the shit to sweep everything under the rug. You know, don’t don’t look into there, everything’s pretty, I can probably pull up an any subject. This is not just lifestyle, any fucking podcasts and they’re going to tell you how awesome they are, or how great this is and what good researchers the art is all for the most part unless you’re listening to like murder podcasts, which there’s a lot of those two


Mickey Gordon  40:39

are the instructional like a lot.


Mallory Gordon  40:42

A lot of them just say this is the right thing to do. And we just don’t always err on every side of it. And I think we have been pretty happy. So we’re gonna incorporate some fun stuff in there too. Don’t Don’t get us wrong. I know keep saying that. But


Mickey Gordon  40:56

I think something else that contributes to the shit is that we haven’t been a hero and fucking forever.


Mallory Gordon  41:00

You know what, that is an excellent point. It is our happy place it is and it’s I’ve become codependent on that being my reset button and my center for and my the light at the end of my tunnel for when I’m having a shipment or ship week or how I mean, it’s fucking COVID Like, a shit fucking year. That that was my outlet. And we went all 2021. And it was the first time in a very long time that we didn’t touch home. And we’re still trying to work out how we’re going to get there in 2021. I know. And it’s hard is it makes me question the kind of person I am that I rely on that as my reset button. Like I’ve put a lot of eggs in that basket to have the that opportunity to do that. And I haven’t found a surrogate for it or the ability to do it without going to keto. But it’s been such a a crucial part of our social and lifestyle lives. That when we took that out, it’s actually been damaging for me my self esteem, my confidence, which we’ll talk about that in another episode. It’s where I really stand out socially, right? I’m the most authentic self when I’m there. And I always feel like I’m filtered. When we’re on land here and in society and unless we’re hanging out with lifestyle friends, like the other weekend, I don’t necessarily feel like I can be myself. So it’s my opportunity to just to know fucking full out


Mickey Gordon  42:34

actually that weekend between illnesses. It’s probably the first time that we fell it kind of felt like keto right here at home when you


Mallory Gordon  42:41

said we felt like ourselves, like fucking preach. 100%


Mickey Gordon  42:46

It’s definitely, uh, you know, speaking of, you know, and I think one of the things that we’ve been missing, and I know there are a bunch of people that listen to this show that are friends of ours through the rascals, we fucking miss all of you, God much.


Mallory Gordon  42:59

Don’t make me cry. Because I know if I talk get into this too deep. I’m gonna start crying because I missed those people. So God damn much and


Mickey Gordon  43:08

entertaining the Rosco part of who we are, and has been for a long time, of


Mallory Gordon  43:11

course, absolutely. And the bonds and the friendships we’ve created. And I hate to say it, I was fucking envious. I loved that. We got to hear how awesome the November and February trips were did a good job, they did a great job. But I’m sitting here and going God, I just wish I was there with you. I wish I was there. And I hate being that person. Because I want to celebrate them for having a good time. But I’m over here fucking kicking rocks, because the more details they gave me about how much fun they had, the more I missed it. Like I remember one conversation where I hung up and I cried a little bit and like what a fucking bitch is that girl? I could test that.


Mickey Gordon  43:48

I think the all these things kind of contribute to the whole do we belong? Are we imposter exactly conversation that you have internally? Right? It exacerbated the issue. Yeah. And keep in mind, guys, there could be any number of reasons that you might feel like an imposter in your own lives. That’s kind of what we’re doing is we’re talking about some things that have led us to these feelings, in hopes that maybe you can identify some normalcy in this, that it’s it’s not just you, it can happen to anybody,


Mallory Gordon  44:14

right? I mean, and this can happen in in lifestyle situations, right. Imposter syndrome is more prevalent than probably people will acknowledge pretty much. Let’s talk about some examples. Yeah, yeah. What about where a couples personal lives create a division in time where one of the two is doing most of the talking online or interacting with couples? So much so that one party feels maybe left out of the conversations or even the relationships altogether?


Mickey Gordon  44:43

Great. So in other words, so one side feels left out completely? Right. And they get maybe envious, right. And we’ve talked about envy versus jealousy before and this means I want to to, but they become jaded.


Mallory Gordon  44:56

Yeah, that’s even worse, because then they disconnect and they investment in the relationships Basically just kind of sees,


Mickey Gordon  45:02

yeah, they let the relationships go because they’re afraid or they even believe that maybe moving too far forward is pointless or frustrating. Yeah, there


Mallory Gordon  45:09

and I don’t know what it is about human behavior. But when you feel like you’re being left behind, like, we don’t give our selves an opportunity to MIT, like, reduce that mental chatter. And and I don’t know, for lack of a better term, catch up, give our give ourselves the opportunity to catch up if we feel left behind. What’s stopping us from doing that? Because we always feel like, what, it’s rude, it’s too late. It’s, it’s an impossibility. What is that about? Because I found myself doing that.


Mickey Gordon  45:37

We’ve actually had that happen with chats, and it’s yeah, you know, when maybe you’re busy at a different time of the day than I am. So I pick up the slack. And now you’re 50 chats behind, because I’m an extrovert and run my mouth a lot. And all the sudden, you kind of get this, what’s the point? I’m out of the conversation now? I’m like, hi, guys, I’m still here, real problems that that that feeling leads to an imposter syndrome. No one wants me hear this. I’m part of this.


Mallory Gordon  46:03

I’m not part of it. I’m not holding my end of the bargain. You know, I’m not as good as my spouse at this, or I’m not as good as the counterpart of the other couple. You start doing the comparisons? Right?


Mickey Gordon  46:12

Well, how about another example. So when one side of the couple feels pushed, or maybe they’re being forced to perform for the satisfaction of the other party, maybe they’re taking one for the team? Or maybe they’re just not feeling it tonight. And their imposter syndrome kicks in when they finally come to terms with what they didn’t want. And they don’t know how to say it without hurting feelings. So


Mallory Gordon  46:35

and now they might have created precedent, right? Yeah. So now they have to be that imposter over and over again. Now, it’s maybe a rinse and repeat cycle that they’ve started and they don’t really hate it. While you’re not always like, conscious, like, what are conscientious? What’s the right term? You don’t acknowledge that it’s happening when it’s happening? It’s always in hindsight, they identify it. Oh, conscious. I don’t know. My vocabulary is in the shitter.


Mickey Gordon  47:02

Two drinks in and recovering COVID. Dude, I


Mallory Gordon  47:05

only had I haven’t even finished my first one because I didn’t want to start slurring at the end of the episode. You’ve


Mickey Gordon  47:10

done that before. It was pretty good. Yeah, I enjoyed that. You know, what I do think, though, is people find themselves in that situation, a lot of different ways. It could be breaking or pushing boundaries, like, you know, full swap, and you’re not ready.


Mallory Gordon  47:22

Oh, what about bisexual? Oh, yeah, that’s another one. I’m sorry. I enter our sexuals. Yeah. Like, there’s, there are situations I’ve seen and even maybe even participated in, you know, way back in the day, where it’s a behavior that maybe that person honestly isn’t into, but it’s an expectation. And since they set that precedent, that they feel like they have to meet that standard every single time. So they’re,


Mickey Gordon  47:47

yeah, well, and I think a good example of that is when maybe women who are not bisexual feel like the girls have to kick play off, right? And even though they’re not by they have to play around. And then they have to get to the point where they are at their point of no return, where they have to tell the girl No, or send her off from taking it further, who had no idea that she wasn’t by


Mallory Gordon  48:07

Yeah. Or they feel compelled to because we’ve done it the last time or the time before that. And now I feel like I have to do it every time.


Mickey Gordon  48:16

Right? And then the last one, I think this is something I’ve actually put you through, certainly more than you put me through it. Because again, I’m a raging extrovert, but sacrificing personal time or rest to party or play when you really don’t feel like it.


Mallory Gordon  48:31

I wouldn’t say they’re egregious. But yeah, if I’m being honest, yeah, it’s I have to raise the flag with you. I have to let you know when I absolutely need that. Or when you by all means you go partied up, you continue to fill your battery, I have to go recharge mine,


Mickey Gordon  48:46

right? Because I’m actually energized by humans, you are actually drained by humans.


Mallory Gordon  48:51

Well, it’s such a weird balance. Yes, and no, like, in the moment, I am fucking charged to the tee. And it’s almost like day drinking and stopping late afternoon, and knowing that you’re going to bed early, because if you don’t continue on, you’re just going to crash and you know, you’re going to crash the end of it anyway. It’s just about prolonging that. Endurance, you know, or tenacity or whatever you want to call it.


Mickey Gordon  49:17

Yeah. Well, and I guess kind of, not necessarily. You know, last because there’s a lot of ways that this can happen a lot of ways that we can be left feeling like imposters or like we’re doing it wrong. And because imposter can be a lot of things right? It’s not just faking it like you know the traditional definition of an imposter but imposter I know I can make words. But you know, when we had everybody here, a few weekends ago, I kind of came away from it feeling like Did we do something wrong? I mean, did people want something and I missed it? I am I a bad swinger for not picking up on signals did somebody I mean, there was one signal that I couldn’t miss. But I was trying not to send the wrong signal at the time gotcha to somebody, which is, you know, nobody that I think even listens to the show. But I think it was a challenge for me because we didn’t play when everybody was here. But partially I mean, I’m starting to feel sicker so we can went on.


Mallory Gordon  50:16

Yeah, it was a weird time. Like, I honestly think if we tried to tee it up, the timing was just off. Because we went from like, I had the really weird period. Right? The one weird time, I think that was working due stress, honestly. And so my hormones are just all over the place, had my blood drawn this week, that shit checked. And then the sickness started to kick in, like, late in the last weekend. So I don’t I think the timing was off, but I get where your head is, because I also left going, did I miss anything? Did anyone if I wanted? Did I want anyone to feel a certain way? And did I give them a wrong impression? Right, because you know how much I love and adore those people. And I felt like I gave off these like, super human platonic fives. Which that’s not me.


Mickey Gordon  51:07

No, because we’re not platonic with no reviews. But in


Mallory Gordon  51:11

hindsight, I was like, what, what was that about?


Mickey Gordon  51:14

Yeah. Well, and then from my side, right, once again, did I send the wrong signals by not asking for the business or not at least being a little more sexually playful? Right? Do people think I’m not into them? Because I don’t?


Mallory Gordon  51:28

You know, I think it’s probably a question we should ask the the respective parties versus maybe debating?


Mickey Gordon  51:36

Do you think I don’t like you?


Mallory Gordon  51:39

But I’d be interested in what their perspective would be, you know, I think Hindsight is 2020. And this is very much, you know, off the cuff for me, but I think that’s probably the best place to start versus a debate here. If I’m being brutally honest.


Mickey Gordon  51:51

So shut the fuck up on the podcast, and you’re talking to the people


Mallory Gordon  51:53

I know that gonna say have to shut the fuck up the cats out of the bag. But I do believe that that’s the proper next step.


Mickey Gordon  52:00

Well, I don’t think there was anybody here that doesn’t know that we love them. Right that we, I mean, they were invited now, all to our house to stay the weekend and hang out if we weren’t, you know, at least down to be their friend. But I think that this goes deeper than that. It’s like, did we want more? Because I don’t think we said we did or we didn’t,


Mallory Gordon  52:19

I think it goes back to that peer conversation too, because not gonna lie. Like, I feel like there’s times where that mental chatter gets to me and I’m wondering if my my friends and my peers are qualifying what kind of swinger or the value of me as a swinger actually is, and that’s a nerving. I don’t even know that they’re actually doing that. That’s just something I’ve decided in my head. It’s just


Mickey Gordon  52:44

the monster under your Uh huh. Absolutely. That’s not your womanizer, by the way. No, no. But so let’s kind of give you guys a cap on this thing. Right, it can happen anybody, but the truth will set you free. How do we get past this?


Mallory Gordon  52:58

Yeah, what’s the plan? How do we can plan how do we kick this thing? And if you’re feeling it yourself, what can you do to break free from your own imposter syndrome?


Mickey Gordon  53:08

Alright, you go first.


Mallory Gordon  53:10

Okay, well, let’s start with whatever you are, whoever you are. It’s fucking Okay. However you are, there’s no definition of a swinger or any permutation that of that is not okay. And I understand very, very clear, this is easier said than done. But this is something you have to maybe use as a mantra. I mean, I, I know, I have to when I’m in these, like, you know, low points, and I’m starting to question and given to that chatter, and at the end of the day, who actually gives a fuck if the label does or doesn’t apply? Does that is that going to change my behavior? If someone unlabeled mis labels? Me? What does that change about me and how I’m going to proceed? And for me, personally, at this point, I have to say fucking nothing.


Mickey Gordon  53:58

That goes back to something that we tell our kids all the time what other people think of you is none of your business.


Mallory Gordon  54:03

Thank you. Right. Right. Yeah. You know, and I think that just goes back to me wanting to be accepted and affirmed by my peers. I think that’s a coordinate that I have.


Mickey Gordon  54:13

No, well, I mean, who gives a flying fuck if the label applies to you? Or doesn’t matter? Period? Yeah. Yeah. 100% of conversation you matter. And whatever you are is fine.


Mallory Gordon  54:24

I think there’s another step though, that comes before that.


Mickey Gordon  54:27

Well, go ahead.


Mallory Gordon  54:29

I think you have to identify what you’re feeling. You have to be honest about it. Are you sad? Are you lonely? envious, jealous, bored? Do you feel left out? Or do you poop out at parties? Are you one popular? Anyone gets that reference. I will show you my kids.


Mickey Gordon  54:47

Every episode she finds a way to show you guys what happens. I think you’re right though. These are all ultimately feelings of inadequacy. And that’s what the imposter syndrome is all about is, am I good enough?


Mallory Gordon  55:03

Yeah, that feeling of an adequacy? Alright, well,


Mickey Gordon  55:07

we all know what it is, oh, cool. It’s something you’re doing not doing, saying. Not saying, and it’s creating this emotion, this emotion that you can’t necessarily put your finger on that makes you feel like maybe you’re not what you purport yourself to be. Is it something somebody else is saying or doing that’s making you feel this way? That’s kind of important because your actions will either be proactive or reactive. As a result of whether it’s something you think someone is seeing or feeling, or something they are saying.


Mallory Gordon  55:39

100% I’m gonna call you out for me my job in cricket because sometimes I need you. And I and I do this for you as well. But I’ll, I’ll call you at you have to tell me when it’s me, or outside influence sometimes, because there are moments where I can’t tell the difference. I’ve decided it’s an outside influence. But I’m in my bubble.


Mickey Gordon  56:00

Reminds me of an early work conversation we had when you joined this company. Yes, we’ll do not all bullets are meant for you. Yes. Just because it’s war, just because they’re flying doesn’t mean it’s yours.


Mallory Gordon  56:09

Yeah, this is very true. And I, I am so appreciative of that. It may be a struggle for me to hear it. It’s time. But I’m appreciative that you give me the opportunity to level set in those moments, I’m sorry, has to be you because I don’t always take that


Mickey Gordon  56:22

criticism. Sometimes go fuck you and run out of my office. No,


Mallory Gordon  56:26

that’s exactly what’s happening. I saw it.


Mickey Gordon  56:30

Well, and this is going to be ad nauseum another fuckin swinger podcast telling you to communicate with your partner. Say what?


Mallory Gordon  56:40

This is a new revelation. Surely


Mickey Gordon  56:42

you just don’t call me Shirley.


Mallory Gordon  56:45

Oh, airplane reference. I got you. I’m old.


Mickey Gordon  56:47

I can make those right. Yeah, man. Check out my glasses, English professor.


Mallory Gordon  56:53

So I think it’s important to tell each other when you’re just not okay. And I do this sometimes even when I don’t know exactly what is happening. But I just go not okay. Definitely not. Okay.


Mickey Gordon  57:04

Not okay over here. And I never realize this. You bless


Mallory Gordon  57:07

your heart. You’re like, Ooh, shit. This could either be very strange or very, very, very long nights. Because I may not know what it means. But I just know I’m not okay. Yeah, yeah.


Mickey Gordon  57:21

I think one of the hardest things to do when somebody starts waving their hands, is leave the blame on the floor. And one


Mallory Gordon  57:30

of the easy mean by that believe the blame on the floor?


Mickey Gordon  57:33

Well, so the easiest thing to do when you get upset, is say something that starts with the word you.


Mallory Gordon  57:42

ownership and accountability there. Yeah,


Mickey Gordon  57:45

you go, you did this. And you did that. And you want me to and you make me feel. And every time you start a sentence with the word you is it, I’m sorry, you’re firing, you’re firing across the field at that point, and the other person is gonna start ducking and running for cover, or start firing back.


Mallory Gordon  58:01

Good thing, you have the aim of a storm trooper, you really do.


Mickey Gordon  58:05

Fucking awesome. Just love watching you just fire away and hit the wall. But now it is true, though, that when you start just hurling shit from your heart that’s driven by fear, and almost always starts with the word you. Yeah. And it never add to the conversation about I feel like or when this happens, it makes me feel this way. And I don’t want to


Mallory Gordon  58:30

do you think subconsciously, we’re always going to be resistant to it because it presents vulnerability that we have to be accountable for all those emotions.


Mickey Gordon  58:39

I think being honest, and being ourselves requires vulnerability and vulnerability is scary when you’re already scared. Yeah, not the last thing you want when you’re already scared is to be more scared. Right? It’s like, Huh, I wonder we should put a horror like a haunted house at the bottom of this roller coaster and see what happens.


Mallory Gordon  58:57

Yeah, no, thanks.


Mickey Gordon  58:58

You know, it’s yeah, we’re full of clowns,


Mallory Gordon  59:00

huh, I’m out.


Mickey Gordon  59:03

I think you have to be honest with yourself and each other and stating what you do and you don’t want from your lifestyle journey. And that changes with the wind. By the way, it’s not set in stone because you want it this weekend and not next weekend. I think that’s hard for people to wrap their head around. It’s hard for us to wrap our head around. So


Mallory Gordon  59:21

I think we should take our own advice on this one. And we might need to just know


Mickey Gordon  59:25

that any fraction doesn’t make you more or less of a swinger or a lifestyler ethically non monogamous or consensually non monogamous or it kingster or poly or whatever the fuck it is you want to you can be an eggplant for all I care, lifestyle, whatever you want to call it. You are what you are and you are what you want to be. Even if you’re a little itty bitty bit of it, and you’re just trying to find your way. It’s okay. Yeah, in fact the heaters fuck them. Well fuck him if you want to fuck them. haterade alright. I think that’s Thumbs up the imposter syndrome, don’t you


Mallory Gordon  1:00:01

just to do you think we should go ahead and do some whiskey of the month here in a minute?


Mickey Gordon  1:00:06

I think we should. Yeah,


Mallory Gordon  1:00:07

it’s been a it’s been a while.


Mickey Gordon  1:00:09

Well, we owe them this one. And if you do this one now and we’re on time with the next episode, we will get march out before the end of March.


Mallory Gordon  1:00:16

Say, whoo, whoo. Yeah, that’ll be awesome. All right.


Mickey Gordon  1:00:20

Well, we’re not gonna make Mallory tell you guys how to find us again. We’ll let her do it at the end of the next segment, thank


Mallory Gordon  1:00:25

God because yes,


Mickey Gordon  1:00:28

I mean, come on. There’s only four of you that hung with us after this fucking break anyway, but we’ll be back in a hot second with February’s whiskey you guys have been listening Oh, back one more time to finish this episode off with whiskey of the month. This is still casual swinger. And this is Mickey.


Mallory Gordon  1:01:01

Yes. And this is Mallory. Guess who’s back? Back is the fucking


Mickey Gordon  1:01:05

mmfs Yeah. All right. This is the Mallory Mathers episode. Yeah, right. So we’re gonna do whiskey the month whiskey of the month is brought to you by fucking us because we don’t have sponsors. No, we don’t.


Mallory Gordon  1:01:20

But I love this one. I’m so excited. Well, now before


Mickey Gordon  1:01:23

we get into that, of course this little line from our friend starting and whiskey of the month. All right, off we go whiskey the month for February Better late than never is. Drumroll please.


Mallory Gordon  1:01:40

Okay, sorry,


Mickey Gordon  1:01:41

bib and Tucker.


Mallory Gordon  1:01:43

Yay. I’m so excited. So this is one of my go to bourbons personally, and it is a bourbon.


Mickey Gordon  1:01:49

It is a six year bourbon.


Mallory Gordon  1:01:52

Which I’m impressed. I find this bourbon to be rather smooth. It’s definitely a staple. It’s probably in my top five most frequented bourbons, especially when we’re out and about drinking.


Mickey Gordon  1:02:01

Yeah, if you see it, you get it. And that’s something I’ve always noted about it. I will tell you guys, this is one of those bourbons that Mallory and I disagree.


Mallory Gordon  1:02:10

I was gonna say this I and I can see why it’s polarizing. You’re either gonna love it or hate it. So if you love it, you’re welcome. If you hate it, talk to Mickey.


Mickey Gordon  1:02:19

This is proof that we equally contribute to the show.


Mallory Gordon  1:02:23

You guys can hate it together. No, sir. I don’t know that you hate it. It’s just not one of your favorites. And you don’t tend to gravitate towards these younger bourbons. Yeah. So this one was born in Tennessee and aged for six years. They’ve been Tucker is a small batch bourbon bourbon that is marketed for its discerning whiskey consumers. So meaning they they acknowledge it’s a smaller market. Yeah, for this the flavor profile at the price point to yes. So the small batch bourbon has received multiple accolades, including 90 points from wine, and 96 points from the tasting panel. So a small batch whiskey is comprised comprised compromise comprised of a selected number of barrels that are mixed together to create a desired taste. So this could range really differently depending on the kind of whiskey you’re talking about. So they can be what 10 To 50 Different barrels.


Mickey Gordon  1:03:14

That’s the general standard for it. And the reason we’re talking about that, guys, is that a lot of people confuse small batch and single barrel, right. And single barrel means it was poured from a single barrel, small batch means it’s a blend of a number of barrels.


Mallory Gordon  1:03:28

Excellent. So a blended bourbon, if you will,


Mickey Gordon  1:03:32

but blended with others kind of like it. It’s not a blend with like a black currant like Vaughn Payne was in the earlier part of this episode. Correct.


Mallory Gordon  1:03:38

Similar recipes. Exactly. The aging in the finishing is where it really develops its flavor. Anyway.


Mickey Gordon  1:03:45

That’s right. So yeah, well, it’s like Ingrid said in our last episode, let the wood do the work.


Mallory Gordon  1:03:49

So I’m gonna just let you know. It’s my fate. Next a will. It’s it’s my favorite bottle.


Mickey Gordon  1:03:56

Oh, it’s the coolest bottle in the business next to will it it is it’s definitely


Mallory Gordon  1:03:59

inspired by by a throwback to like the 1800s Saloon era. Like you look at the spot on go, I have to uncork it with my mouth. Right? You like


Mickey Gordon  1:04:09

it off? Like you’re in a trade swilling it get it


Mallory Gordon  1:04:13

out. Pick it right for the bottle. Like it’s a beautiful, very well done bottles, voters nostalgia.


Mickey Gordon  1:04:19

It’s funny that you mentioned that because the words bib and Tucker are actually a throwback to an 1800s phrase. Get the fuck out. I didn’t know that. They are. It’s actually the phrase bib and Tucker was used to describe one’s finest attire. Oh, in the 1800s. So when you went out on for a night on the town, you put on your bib and Tucker.


Mallory Gordon  1:04:40

Oh, get out. I’m totally using that forevermore.


Mickey Gordon  1:04:43

Yeah. So that’s something something cool about that way.


Mallory Gordon  1:04:46

So it kind of looks like the way they designed us to non to that area. It looks like an enlarged flax. Right. It’s a dark brown bottle with embossed words on it. So it almost looks like it came from like an apothecary. or like the snake oil salesman? Back in the day on the wagons, right? Yeah.


Mickey Gordon  1:05:04

Yeah. Well, I think it’s kind of a throwback to the refinement of that era, right? I mean, it just kind of Yes. Boss, like send out letters on the bottle because there’s no label on the bell. There’s nothing. There’s one sticker. That’s it. And it’s over the top. Yes. I mean, there’s really nothing to it. And there’s a little lake like hand strong label kind of tag and


Mallory Gordon  1:05:24

even even the cork looks hand drilled or pressed.


Mickey Gordon  1:05:28

Right. So I think that it’s really makes it feel appropriate for a special occasion a dinner party hanging out.


Mallory Gordon  1:05:35

Yeah, it’s ornate, I would definitely describe it as ornate.


Mickey Gordon  1:05:39

Sure. Now, this bottle retails for 4899 Total Wine everywhere in the country for the six year if you go upwards from there to the 10 year or higher, you’re the clear whiskey, for example, you’re going to pay a little more for it. But the 4899 price point does qualify it for whiskey of the month.


Mallory Gordon  1:05:55

Yes, this is true. And again, one of my top fives. We’ll get into the tasty notes in a minute. But on your research, you said was founded in 2013. And I didn’t realize it was that young as far as a brand goes.


Mickey Gordon  1:06:10

Yeah, it was fairly new on the scene, right? I mean, and it was founded by a guy that’s famous for wine.


Mallory Gordon  1:06:17

It’s, this is another one we found because we’ll talk about the 19 crimes burning chair and all that stuff at a later date. But this is another really great bourbon that was founded by winemakers. And I find that fascinating that there’s this transition and knowledge base that goes along with it. So this guy’s name was August Sebastiani. Yep, right. And his company 35 Maple Street initially launched bib and Tucker, as an eight year bourbon from an undisclosed Tennessee distillery. But by the time the brands started shipping, it was being bottled as an OEM in Crestwood, Kentucky. Yeah, which I found interesting.


Mickey Gordon  1:06:54

Yeah. Well, and, you know, one of the biggest delays was starting the brand was the bottle. Yeah, they had such an a vision for what this bottle was going to look like and feel like that it was actually arguably more important than what was in it.


Mallory Gordon  1:07:08

You know, and I, you have to have an appreciation for the go to market strategy, and then investment in the visual aid that comes along with it. Because let’s face it, such a good portion of drinking is partly mental, the look in the field of taste, and the application is totally part of the experience. But let’s all be honest, we’re suckers for cool


Mickey Gordon  1:07:28

bottles? Well, I think it goes back to if you want to like something, there’s a better chance you will. Yeah. Right. And that can go for a lot of things in life. If I want to be pissed off, and I don’t want to like something, it’s gonna be a lot harder for me to like it. I mean, I did not want to like Vaughn pain. Yeah, that’s true. And I got it. I didn’t want a model. I looked at everything they were trying to do. And I’m so pissed off that somebody is targeting the lifestyle. And then it was amazing. And this is another one where I mean, if you want to like it, you’re probably going to and Bevin, Tucker, we’ll get into the tasting notes here in a second. But that 18 month delay with that unique bottle. I mean that it’s an amber customize bottle that created so many issues for these guys, and really kind of gave that a lower back. And that was before those really unique flavors jumped out at you. And the first time you


Mallory Gordon  1:08:11

had been oh my gosh, I loved it what I noticed versus a lot lighter in color than the Bourbons or whiskies actually, it’s probably in line with bourbons, but it is on the lighter side. It’s like a light copper gold. Right when you pour it in with your drinking, right, expect a deeper rich more caramel, you know, color to it. On the nose, like you can get a little chocolate you definitely get oak, maybe a little bit of vanilla on it, but the flavor is what got me it’s definitely gonna be a little warmer and I say that because you get ginger and cinnamon in there. A little bit of Carmel, obviously. And it’s finished. It’s it’s warm, it lingers for a bit and it’s a little hot, but it’s hot off the bat. It’s so hot on the backside. So


Mickey Gordon  1:08:57

yeah, hot in the backside can mean a lot of things if you’re a swinger but for whiskey, it just means it burns a little bit.


Mallory Gordon  1:09:03

It does you know, this is not a bourbon I necessarily drink neat. I do drink it over, you know, large ice cube and let it melt a little bit has a natural cool water back to it. Yeah,


Mickey Gordon  1:09:12

I actually see this as being a complimentary whiskey for something like a Manhattan


Mallory Gordon  1:09:19

I think yeah, no, I can see that in Manhattan when you add the sweet and the bitterness to it and to help balance that out and


Mickey Gordon  1:09:24

balance out that hot little bit. Yeah, but these guys by the way,


Mallory Gordon  1:09:28

they’re gonna be good in a French night. 95 Oh, yeah,


Mickey Gordon  1:09:31

there you go. Now you’re talking English language. Right? But these guys are not longer are no longer owned by Maple Street by the way. They’re owned by Deutsch spirits and bib and Tucker is part of a brand family that now includes stalwarts such as Masterson and redemption


Mallory Gordon  1:09:45

whiskies I was gonna say Deutsches really scooped up some really good brands. Yeah, those


Mickey Gordon  1:09:49

are slick bastards they’re doing they picked up a couple of really good ones, but they know what they’re doing but we’re gonna put a link to total wine in the show notes so you guys can check out bib and Tucker for yourself. But this is a nationally available brand, you should be able to get it just about anywhere you love whiskey and remember, for the 4899 price point, you should be able to find that just about anywhere and qualify for whiskey of the month. But if you want to go higher end by all means look at their 10 year look up the realm a little bit. These are all blended whiskies. Small batch whiskies. They’re OEMs. So this is all about the finish. And if you like it, you’ll love it. And if you don’t play Mallory,


Mallory Gordon  1:10:28

now you’ll talk to Mickey.



Oh, it’s all my fault. Well, no, so


Mallory Gordon  1:10:33

you guys can heat it together. And I’m just


Mickey Gordon  1:10:34

kidding. But hey, this would be the first month we’ve ever been to whiskey of the month because this was February’s whiskey of the month and again, we’ll put that in the show notes so you guys know where to find it. Where to buy it if you love it. If you hate it. It’s all good. But Mallory, we’re gonna get the fuck out of here. It’s been an hour and a half minutes.


Mallory Gordon  1:10:49

You know what we fucking miss you guys. Thanks for accepting us back into the community and not judging us.


Mickey Gordon  1:10:54

They haven’t accepted us yet. We might get five listens. Oh,


Mallory Gordon  1:10:57

yes. Subdiv close, sir. It


Mickey Gordon  1:10:59

is bitch.


Mallory Gordon  1:11:01

Yes, it is.


Mickey Gordon  1:11:03

Alright, since you’re being presumptuous, tell us where to find us.


Mallory Gordon  1:11:05

We is casual speaker everywhere. You can find us a casual or shoot us a note at podcast at Coastal We are on social media Facebook, YouTube, Instagram and Twitter sexy Twitter. And you can also find us on the dating sites at somebody nation sec, SLS and Cassidy


Mickey Gordon  1:11:22

alright guys coming up in no time at all. We’ve got another episode coming your way and don’t forget 30 days a lingerie is coming your way. 30 different days I’m gonna post Mallory’s sweet ass on Twitter.


Mallory Gordon  1:11:33

I can’t wait to snatch that laundry. I’m so excited.


Mickey Gordon  1:11:37

It’s gonna be hotter than bib and Tucker. Thanks so much for hanging with us guys. We’ll be back in just a couple of weeks promise we won’t be late with the next one. You’ve been listening to casually swinger